Beginners homebuild project- which one
Beginners homebuild project- which one
A friend and I were discussing the possibility of maybe building a homebuild microlight at some stage. Our interest lies with three axis. We do not want to build a kit but rather want to look at getting info on plans built types such as Legal Eagle, Volksplane etc. What views and advice do you have for a relatively simple project? Does not need to be two seater.
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andrepieterse
- Learning to fly
- Posts: 63
- Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 8:08 pm
- Location: Stellenbosch
what you are asking for is the Holy Grail, very illusive.
Plans built aircraft take thousands of hours which translate into years and years of frustrating fruitless build. I would suggest building a kit first time round and see if you have the commitment. At least you can sell the partially complete kit to someone else if you don't complete it. If you do and you enjoy it, great!!, then embark this project. If not at least you have a nice aerie to fly or sell and return your investment
Plans built aircraft take thousands of hours which translate into years and years of frustrating fruitless build. I would suggest building a kit first time round and see if you have the commitment. At least you can sell the partially complete kit to someone else if you don't complete it. If you do and you enjoy it, great!!, then embark this project. If not at least you have a nice aerie to fly or sell and return your investment
Greg Perkins
Hi Swiftprop,
To build a kit or scratchbuild is a mission. So you need dedication . You will need to plan on doing at least an hours worth of PRODUCTIVE work every evening.
A huge amount of time is spend peering at plans or assembly manuals trying to work up the courage to actually cut or rim a part, so measure twice and cut once and most importantly do something.
Funds available will dictate what route you will follow.
Kit build is easier but you pay for all those prefab parts.
Plans build is longer but usually cheaper. I say usually because it is very easy to build two left parts when in fact you need one left and one right handed part. Been there done that!
As for what type .... A VP1 is very basic, very easy to construct, can be build for beer and cigarette money (well nearly) material used is wood and plywood with a bare minimum of metal parts needing welding.
Plans are very good.
All the wood is available locally and the imported hardware items are also available locally from Placo and others.
A VP can be build in 6 months of evening work.
The designer said if you dont finish in 6 months then you were doing something else.
You basically build a wooden box with 4 bulkheads for the fuselage, 2 wings with wooden spars and routed plywood ribs, 2 ailerons, 1 all-flying horizontal stabiliser. and one rudder.
Part count is very low per component.
Skill level is also very low
You will however have to pay great attention to detail, as you should, because you will sit in and fly this ctreation of yours.
Cost wise all the wood and plywood can probably be bought for under R7,000
Tools you need are very basic BUT a wood planer or access to one is a great time saver when making longerons and Spars. A Radial Arm Saw is also a great time saver.
I have build a VP1 and it took me 18 months where I did not do anything for weeks at a time. If I had to build one again I think I can easily finish it in 3 months working 8 hours per day 5 days per week.
Scrounging ability is very usefull but sometimes it is easier to just buy the part and move on.
All in all a VP is probably the easiest project to build. Is a very safe and docile flyer cruising at 60 -70 mph. It is also very very strong. The designer was a professional Aero Engineer.
Finally it does not matter what you build, kit or scratch build, but do it at home, this alone will save many hours of time. It is easier to walk to the garage than to drive to the airfield, or wherever you have your workshop, in the evenings.
The Legal Eagle will give its best performance when build as per plans in other words using the imported 4130 Chrome Moly tubing. This can put a damper on the project when you see prices, in the region of R25 for 300mm or in the region of R83 per meter and then having to pay a qualified welder probably R150 per hour to weld up the fuselage and it takes 12 -15 hours to weld a fuselage.
You can use local tubing but the aircraft WILL be heavier and not perform as expected, because local tubing is thicker wall thickness and therfore heavier.
Stick to the plans this will save you many hours of wasted time. Trying to "improve" a design is best left to the designers or suitably qualified persons. Been there and was severely dissapointed with my "improvements"
Me , All I improved was the weight of my VP!!!! So they were scrapped.
ie wasted a lot of time effort and money.
Also bear in mind to build something that is already on the register, otherwise yours will be the first of type and you will have to prove to the CAA that your A/C is strong enough by doing all the load tests. Again extra time and plenty money and plenty aggro.
As a starting point buy the plans for whatever you want to build and study them then ask questions and study them some more then do the costing and availability checks, before jumping in both feet first.
Hope this helps your decision making process.
Kind regards,
Gunter
To build a kit or scratchbuild is a mission. So you need dedication . You will need to plan on doing at least an hours worth of PRODUCTIVE work every evening.
A huge amount of time is spend peering at plans or assembly manuals trying to work up the courage to actually cut or rim a part, so measure twice and cut once and most importantly do something.
Funds available will dictate what route you will follow.
Kit build is easier but you pay for all those prefab parts.
Plans build is longer but usually cheaper. I say usually because it is very easy to build two left parts when in fact you need one left and one right handed part. Been there done that!
As for what type .... A VP1 is very basic, very easy to construct, can be build for beer and cigarette money (well nearly) material used is wood and plywood with a bare minimum of metal parts needing welding.
Plans are very good.
All the wood is available locally and the imported hardware items are also available locally from Placo and others.
A VP can be build in 6 months of evening work.
The designer said if you dont finish in 6 months then you were doing something else.
You basically build a wooden box with 4 bulkheads for the fuselage, 2 wings with wooden spars and routed plywood ribs, 2 ailerons, 1 all-flying horizontal stabiliser. and one rudder.
Part count is very low per component.
Skill level is also very low
You will however have to pay great attention to detail, as you should, because you will sit in and fly this ctreation of yours.
Cost wise all the wood and plywood can probably be bought for under R7,000
Tools you need are very basic BUT a wood planer or access to one is a great time saver when making longerons and Spars. A Radial Arm Saw is also a great time saver.
I have build a VP1 and it took me 18 months where I did not do anything for weeks at a time. If I had to build one again I think I can easily finish it in 3 months working 8 hours per day 5 days per week.
Scrounging ability is very usefull but sometimes it is easier to just buy the part and move on.
All in all a VP is probably the easiest project to build. Is a very safe and docile flyer cruising at 60 -70 mph. It is also very very strong. The designer was a professional Aero Engineer.
Finally it does not matter what you build, kit or scratch build, but do it at home, this alone will save many hours of time. It is easier to walk to the garage than to drive to the airfield, or wherever you have your workshop, in the evenings.
The Legal Eagle will give its best performance when build as per plans in other words using the imported 4130 Chrome Moly tubing. This can put a damper on the project when you see prices, in the region of R25 for 300mm or in the region of R83 per meter and then having to pay a qualified welder probably R150 per hour to weld up the fuselage and it takes 12 -15 hours to weld a fuselage.
You can use local tubing but the aircraft WILL be heavier and not perform as expected, because local tubing is thicker wall thickness and therfore heavier.
Stick to the plans this will save you many hours of wasted time. Trying to "improve" a design is best left to the designers or suitably qualified persons. Been there and was severely dissapointed with my "improvements"
Me , All I improved was the weight of my VP!!!! So they were scrapped.
ie wasted a lot of time effort and money.
Also bear in mind to build something that is already on the register, otherwise yours will be the first of type and you will have to prove to the CAA that your A/C is strong enough by doing all the load tests. Again extra time and plenty money and plenty aggro.
As a starting point buy the plans for whatever you want to build and study them then ask questions and study them some more then do the costing and availability checks, before jumping in both feet first.
Hope this helps your decision making process.
Kind regards,
Gunter
My Suggestion would be to build a Bush Baby.
If i had to do it all over again. I would keep the friends i have made but i would build a bush baby or such like kit first.
Gunter puts it all in a nutshell.
If i had to do it all over again. I would keep the friends i have made but i would build a bush baby or such like kit first.
Gunter puts it all in a nutshell.
Gavin van der Berg - ZS-WWF
“The genius controls the chaos”
One of the Proud Chain Gang Founding Members
“The genius controls the chaos”
One of the Proud Chain Gang Founding Members
Very informative post Gunther, it smacks of experience !!
Three questions though, do the VP1 not fall in the PPL category ?
And the second question, what is the absolute minimum horsepower
needed for this aircraft ?
The last one, will it be safe to try to make it go 100mph by playing with
a bigger engine and prop pitch etc ?
I think that Hawk microlight would be a relatively easy scratchbuild if
one could get the plans. Looks like a very simple in design.
Three questions though, do the VP1 not fall in the PPL category ?
And the second question, what is the absolute minimum horsepower
needed for this aircraft ?
The last one, will it be safe to try to make it go 100mph by playing with
a bigger engine and prop pitch etc ?
I think that Hawk microlight would be a relatively easy scratchbuild if
one could get the plans. Looks like a very simple in design.
Hi Smallfly,
I will try to answer your questions in the order they were asked.
I think the VP1 with a VW engine will fall in the PPL category, maybe Tailspin can provide more info on this. The prototype VP1 weighed in at 440Lbs (200kg) but it had no starter, a cut down flywheel that only the oil seal part remained, no alernator/generator and no battery.
Starting was by Hand standing behind the engine in front of the wing LE.
A properly set up VW will fire very quickly and starts very easily.
But the VP can be made lighter by using a lighter engine (Rotax 503), and lighter type of Undercarriage with smaller lighter go cart type wheels and brakes. This will not effect structural integrity.
It may then fit into the MPL category. The best way of building a light A/C is to stick to the plans.
The original VP1 was build and fitted with a 1500cc VW motor the aircraft flew OK with this but rate of climb was not good.
So they fitted a 1600cc and this made it an all round better performer.
Most people in the USA opt for the 1835cc power plant, this works well in hot an high places like Denver in the USA. (more or less same height as GP)
To increace speed it makes more sense to reduce drag than to add more HP = more weight which = more fuel consumption = less range = bigger tanks = more weight etc.
Putting on wing root fairings should add a couple of mph and adding a canopy will probably add a wopping 10 - 12 mph The wing tips can also benefit from streamlinined fairings. Wheel spats can also add a couple of mph. Spinner on the prop will also be of benefit.
The trick here is to make the fairings as light as possible, but also just strong enough for their purpose.
I remember Derek Hopkins telling me more than 22 years ago that Lil Mo was a very marginal A/C when he got it with no canopy so he put on a Canopy and that turned this A/C into a real good performer.
Kind regards,
Gunter
I will try to answer your questions in the order they were asked.
I think the VP1 with a VW engine will fall in the PPL category, maybe Tailspin can provide more info on this. The prototype VP1 weighed in at 440Lbs (200kg) but it had no starter, a cut down flywheel that only the oil seal part remained, no alernator/generator and no battery.
Starting was by Hand standing behind the engine in front of the wing LE.
A properly set up VW will fire very quickly and starts very easily.
But the VP can be made lighter by using a lighter engine (Rotax 503), and lighter type of Undercarriage with smaller lighter go cart type wheels and brakes. This will not effect structural integrity.
It may then fit into the MPL category. The best way of building a light A/C is to stick to the plans.
The original VP1 was build and fitted with a 1500cc VW motor the aircraft flew OK with this but rate of climb was not good.
So they fitted a 1600cc and this made it an all round better performer.
Most people in the USA opt for the 1835cc power plant, this works well in hot an high places like Denver in the USA. (more or less same height as GP)
To increace speed it makes more sense to reduce drag than to add more HP = more weight which = more fuel consumption = less range = bigger tanks = more weight etc.
Putting on wing root fairings should add a couple of mph and adding a canopy will probably add a wopping 10 - 12 mph The wing tips can also benefit from streamlinined fairings. Wheel spats can also add a couple of mph. Spinner on the prop will also be of benefit.
The trick here is to make the fairings as light as possible, but also just strong enough for their purpose.
I remember Derek Hopkins telling me more than 22 years ago that Lil Mo was a very marginal A/C when he got it with no canopy so he put on a Canopy and that turned this A/C into a real good performer.
Kind regards,
Gunter
Hi Swiftprop,
Check this link
http://microlighters.co.za/viewtopic.php?t=5414
A teenie Two in the begin stages with most material and some work done.
May be an alternative to starting from scratch.
Kind regards,
Gunter
Check this link
http://microlighters.co.za/viewtopic.php?t=5414
A teenie Two in the begin stages with most material and some work done.
May be an alternative to starting from scratch.
Kind regards,
Gunter
Teenie two
Hi Gunter
I have sent a pm to Skyvan re his project. Thanks for the info. This is the e-mail I received from JDT Mini Max. Interesting to see that they are looking at wood!
Regards
Hello Andre,
We will not be producing the original Team airbike kit. We are working a replacement
of the airbike with a wood fuselage instead of steel. We had hoped to have it ready to
market by now but we do not have the plans completed yet. It appears that it will be at
least spring 2008 before we have it ready to market.
Regards,
JDT Mini-Max LLC
John Graber
I have sent a pm to Skyvan re his project. Thanks for the info. This is the e-mail I received from JDT Mini Max. Interesting to see that they are looking at wood!
Regards
Hello Andre,
We will not be producing the original Team airbike kit. We are working a replacement
of the airbike with a wood fuselage instead of steel. We had hoped to have it ready to
market by now but we do not have the plans completed yet. It appears that it will be at
least spring 2008 before we have it ready to market.
Regards,
JDT Mini-Max LLC
John Graber
Hi Swiftprop,
A wood version of the Airbike, magic
what engine could be used a 503 perhaps?
Yes this could be a budget build that will rival the VP in simplicity.
Easier to get into at any rate than the VP. and it is faster so probably a better performer all round.
Keep us updated how you get along.
Kind regards,
Gunter
A wood version of the Airbike, magic
what engine could be used a 503 perhaps?Yes this could be a budget build that will rival the VP in simplicity.
Easier to get into at any rate than the VP. and it is faster so probably a better performer all round.
Keep us updated how you get along.
Kind regards,
Gunter
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