Tips on flying in turbulance

[Fairy Flycatcher]

I was affraid coming in skew that we were going to roll or something. Since then it has become a mental thing, a BIG THING .

What do you fly? A trike does come in skew when landing X-wind, and as the first back wheel touches down, it swings the undercariage in the direction of travel, pointing down the runway.

Cross-wind landing has its own a very specific techniques, and various aircraft have different ways of doing it.

I had a similar experience to you with a x-wind at La Mercy, as the x-wind comes over a dune and forrest, it causes rotor turbulence on top of everything else. Did two go-arounds before a great laniding on the 3rd one. I have now forced myself to fly whenever the weather allows for a tricky but still safe Runway 20, and am just starting to get over my fear of that wind direction.

Don't be scared of go-arounds. Even Jumbo's have to do it occasionally.

Had an A-grade instructor bounce the training plane with a flip realy hard, and when asked why he did not do a go-around, as there was now damage on the aircraft he said " I don't do go-arounds" He will not work for me again

[Slurp]

Based on the replies, there are the honest pilots (who really Cr*p themselves, like me ) and there are those who will never admit to it.

An absolute prerequisite is to know your sky. However, you will get caught sometimes. If it happens, the main thing is not to panic

Normally a good tune (music or yours) and no tight grips on the bar work well. Having my flying buds in my sights also helps. ('Cause I know they're going through the same )

Don't let a bad flight put you off. Learn and go on. It is good to learn to fly in the stuff for those longer distance journeys

Cheers

[Trytofly]

I was affraid coming in skew that we were going to roll or something. Since then it has become a mental thing, a BIG THING .

What do you fly?

I have a Windlass with an Aquilla wing. I have since done one afternoon of x-wind landing and come up with the following: Try and gather as much speed as possible on short finals without power and roundout/flare as late as possible (without flattening yourself ), using VERY little power to allow the plane a little more speed after roundout. This seemed to work, although I only did it twice then packed away.

[IFLYHI]

roundout/flare as late as possible (without flattening yourself ),

In other words like Ford Perfect explained "Trow yourself at the ground but make sure you miss"

I found that a higher speed does help, if the normal speed over the numbers are 60mph, in a strong x-wind I approach 70mph and basically fly the plane "longer" before the flare.

[Fairy Flycatcher]

I was affraid coming in skew that we were going to roll or something. Since then it has become a mental thing, a BIG THING .

What do you fly?

I have a Windlass with an Aquilla wing. I have since done one afternoon of x-wind landing and come up with the following: Try and gather as much speed as possible on short finals without power and roundout/flare as late as possible (without flattening yourself ), using VERY little power to allow the plane a little more speed after roundout. This seemed to work, although I only did it twice then packed away.

Hi Trytofly

Your approach is not ideal for a number of reasons.

Coming in as fast as possible, does not allow you to pitch the nose down if you have to when you encounter turbulence. Too much airspeed actually reduces your ability to fly turbulence successfully, as it can make for scary turbulent flying.

Too fast can also cause pilot induced oscillations, and this can be worse than turbulence. PIO can be really frightening, and recognising it is a very important part of training, but some instructors do not spend enough time on this subject.

In turbulence, or in a cross-wind, you do not want to wait to touch down as late and as slow as possible. You want to have controlled flight at all times and fly it gently onto the ground, maintaining enough airspeed to allow for corrections in turbulence, and touch down at the appropriate angle (back wheels first), dumping the power last second to allow you to settle.

Would you mind sending me your cell number in a PM, and I would love to ask my skygod to phone you back, or you can phone him on 084 266 3359.

Anyone who wants advice on trike flying, you are most welcome to phone either myself, Anette or David. Sometimes there is just too much to be written down.

[DarkHelmet]

I was taught to keep my airspeed at 55mph (obviously aircraft specific) on the approach, no more, no less... And yes - got warned a few times for PIO'ing!

[ZU-ANE]

I was taught the same thing, and it caused some really scary landings. Slower with some power is the way to go.

[RV4ker (RIP)]

Me gotta remember to push and not look for centreline with Ruddaaar

PS
IFLYHI
Comming in at big speed limits your options. Use the headwind component (if any) to your advantange to slow you down and use controlled slow decent. The steep approach is very difficult to do repeatedly. You gonna get varying results and the balloon will be bigger than if at slow speed. PIO are also a problem. Also if you get wind sear you may have interesting arrival, but use what works for you most times.... If the steep thing works for you go for it as long as you are aware of the possible pitfals and how to deal with them.

my 2c
(comment based on very limited trike and little bit of blik aerie bashing)

[Morph]

Landing a 3-axis in turbulance and or cross-wind (at Morning Star, any wind, especially an easterly crosswind produces huge turbulance) I was taught the following and it works well for me

Approach speed, 5MPH faster than your normal (65mph instead of 60 for me), come in on power all the way down, I reduce throttle to about 3000-3500 rpm and be prepared to add power immediately if you hit a sudden sink. I am very active on the throttle all the way down using it to adjust my rate of decent. If you have hangars or such that produce rotors try to land further down the runway away from them if that is clear and there is sufficient runway to land. Fly the plane all the way down. Once in ground effect it usually smooths out, but not always. I reduce throttle to idle only just before I touch down. For crosswind, drop the wind side wing slightly and use the rudders to straighten out just before touch down. Keep the ailerons deflected even though you are on the ground until your speed has bled right off.

[cornell]

Yes Skybound you are right about the aircraft that broke up in mid air form turbulance but that is why it is important to know your POH. When you hit Turbulance make sure your airspeed is in the green. I have notice so many times guys don't look at the ASI. If you Follow the POH skybound an aircraft will NOT break up in mid air

[IFLYHI]

PS
IFLYHI
Comming in at big speed limits your options. Use the headwind component (if any) to your advantange to slow you down and use controlled slow decent. The steep approach is very difficult to do repeatedly. You gonna get varying results and the balloon will be bigger than if at slow speed. PIO are also a problem. Also if you get wind sear you may have interesting arrival, but use what works for you most times.... If the steep thing works for you go for it as long as you are aware of the possible pitfals and how to deal with them.

my 2c
(comment based on very limited trike and little bit of blik aerie bashing) :wink



Actually I should have elaborated For my 3-axis T-Bird

Exactly the opposite, I go in faster but at a low approach angle, this means I would need a much longer RW. For me this approach means I get better penetration and I fly her onto the deck, as Morpheus pointed out until I get the more stable ground effect, then only do I come off the power completely. But I will concede this approach chows RW so you better have plenty. Also the more x-wind the less flaps I use, again the the causes more RW you need but I think that reduces the wing loading therefore less bumpy


PS what is PIO

PSS this quote thing does not work today

[Sonex711]

PS what is PIO

Hi IFLYHI,

PIO = Pilot Inducted Oscillation - the thing that bends nose forks - ask me, I've been there

[Morph]

PSS this quote thing does not work today

Make sure you have [ followed by quote, no /, then =, then the name i.e. "morpheus" and close ] then have the line you are quoting and close it off with [ followed by / then quote then ]. Nothing else. Use the preview tab to see if it is working and if not, go down and edit the post. The quote button should automatically put the open and close quote statements in and you can just fill in the line between them.

PIO = Pilot Inducted Oscillation - the thing that bends nose forks - ask me, I've been there

Is this only on trikes and not 3-axis as I have never heard about it from any of my instructors?

[Sonex711]

PIO = Pilot Inducted Oscillation - the thing that bends nose forks - ask me, I've been there

Is this only on trikes and not 3-axis as I have never heard about it from any of my instructors?

Happened on my T-bird (3-axis). Something to do with me being a bit behind what's happening the plane. Note to self - never push the stick forward in a bounce

[Fairy Flycatcher]

by Alfred Scott

This article appeared in the September 1992 Falco Builders Letter.
.....
We'll have a more complete report on the Sequoia 300 from Al Aitken later, but it appears that when the few bugs are worked out, it will be an excellent airplane to fly. Most disturbing was a very serious problem with ground-handling. The airplane has a tendency to get into pilot-induced-occilations on the ground, to the point where Al Aitken was skidding the tires on landing roll. It was more difficult to steer, he said, than any taildragger he had flown. We've since fixed the problem with stronger springs in the steering system. Also, while the airplane is stable in pitch, the stick-force gradient is rather shallow.

......

Seems like PIO is not limited to Trikes. Although I'd prefer PIO on the ground rather than in the air

Probably just easier to experience it in a trike, as the pendulum effect of the trike make it want to recover from a turn-disturbance by itself.

If the pilot then add to this by trying to correct, and gets a bit behind the response rate of the aircraft (easy when flying to fast on a light-roll aircraft), then each recover is followed by an increased turn in the opposite direction. It is essential that you learn how to both recognise this, and recover from it, as the aircraft can go into a wing-over from which you might have too little height to recover, or even go inverted