When is an accident an accident or an incident???

[Leprachaun]

Hi Folks just returned from an interresting meeting with Beeg Brother (CAA ) last week - had a rap or two on the knuckles and an interresting debate - Re the Accident / incident issue -
The older folks with the experience let the appie pilots know what is an accident and when is it an incident -
A tip pse check those lekka thick big blue books your flight office has
- ChecK the definitions -
LET THE DEBATE BEGIN !
Leprachaun

[Morph]

In short this is the way I see it (IMHO)

Incident - No injuries, there could be damage to one or more aircraft. Examples are running off a runway, breaking a wheel, rolling a trike over, bending some bars etc. Bad landing bending axles. One aircraft striking another aircraft on the graound causing damage. Additionally near-misses (should be called near hits) in the air are also incidents. The defining factor no injuries to any living thing

Accident - Any incident resulting in the death or injury to persons, animals etc plus damage to third parties property

[Arnulf]

Incident:
An occurance associated with the operation of an aeroplane, but not necessarily occuring on board an aeroplane, which results in injury to a person, or damage to an aeroplane or which could jeopardize the aeroplane or its occupants and/or could affect the safety of operation.

Serious Incident:
An incident involving circumstances indicating that an accident nearly occurred.

Accident:
An occurance associated with the operation of an aeroplane, which takes place between the time any person boards the aeroplane with the intention of flight, until such time all persons have disembarked, in which
a) a person is fatally or seriously injured as a result of being in the aircraft, or direct contact with any part of the aircraft, including parts which have become detached from the aircraft, or direct exposure to jet blast

b) the aircraft sustains damage or structural failure which: adversely affects the structural strength, performance or flight characteristics of the aircraft, and would normally require major repair or replacement of the affected component,

c) the aeroplane is missing, or completely inaccessible.

[Morph]

Cool thanks

[John Young]

Agree with Arnulf’s technical “as per the book” quote – obviously

However, put much more simply –

An accident can be defined as an aircraft needing to be repaired before it can be flown again even if the repair is minor.

An incident is anything else, which obviously excludes normal operation.

Injury, bodily harm, damage to 3rd party property and / or death could occur in either an accident (e.g. CFIT) or an incident (e.g. petrol fire).

Who does not agree

Regards
John ZU-CIB

[ZULU1]

Interesting topic as about two months ago, Rodney and I were taking pics of our airfield for the migration of hangars from La Mercy.

I called "down wind 08 Ballito" and was on downwind but was higher than normal at 1,000 ft descending...a yahoo in a fixed wing decided to attempt an emergency over our field, he was descending from above me and blind at 8 oclock high and about 100ft from me, he did not call and should have been aware of my position. Very close shave indeed..

Needless he was given some lip...but is this in fact not an incident and should I not have reported it ?? It was very unpleasant as he had no idea what was the form until I shouted at the blighter.

eish ZULU1

[DieselFan]

Had a similar incident recently, I'm getting myself a lekker large Ketty we'll see how he likes brown pants

Also I wouldn't report it - Then there's a paper trail

[Dreamer]

I would say that was def an incident, my 2c is an incident is one where no-one is injured and no plane is damaged( a close call), an accident is one where plane or person is injured and as I understand it both need to be reported.