African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs" (NOT)

[John Boucher]

Cornell

There is more here than meets the eye... there are definitely some personal gripes that have washed over into generalisation. Think about it, how many blik pilots smoke close or even in their aircraft and are not called "thugs" because of this? A more suitable choice of words would have been appropriate in lines of "irresponsible" perhaps? The branding of any aviation group because of behaviour is wrong. If you can convince me that not one blik pilot has done the same, I'll retract my words with an apology but you know as well as I do that won't be happening. Attack the aviator rather than the group...

As for the "Wally Award" - this was done in good jest but not received as such. Let me tell you, I asked what must I do to get one because it is rather an awesome item to put on the shelf in the bar I dare say.

Like it or not - the persistence of the MISASA has done more good than the "old die hards" care to admit.

[Leprachaun]

Brilliant Leprachaun

[cornell]

Cornell

There is more here than meets the eye... there are definitely some personal gripes that have washed over into generalisation. Think about it, how many blik pilots smoke close or even in their aircraft and are not called "thugs" because of this? A more suitable choice of words would have been appropriate in lines of "irresponsible" perhaps? The branding of any aviation group because of behaviour is wrong. If you can convince me that not one blik pilot has done the same, I'll retract my words with an apology but you know as well as I do that won't be happening. Attack the aviator rather than the group...

As for the "Wally Award" - this was done in good jest but not received as such. Let me tell you, I asked what must I do to get one because it is rather an awesome item to put on the shelf in the bar I dare say.

Like it or not - the persistence of the MISASA has done more good than the "old die hards" care to admit.

Howzit John don't get me wrong I also think that the name calling was completely uncalled for but why lower yourself (and please I don't mean you ) to the the authors level.

Another thing why do we always have to revert to Blik VS ML I've got huge respect for all but sometimes it feels that some just use it as a excuse like our government using Apartheid

[kloot piloot]

Thanks Cornell for your input. As for identifying smoking people, Athol should be able to provide what you are wanting. He picked it up, he complained and I'm sure he will answer you on that one. He might even have photos and we will name and shame. Microlighters are not petty. We sort our kak quickly. Expect smoker's photos from now on, both here and on Avcom.

But I want to keep this thread going, not to be anal, but to keep the AeCSA debate alive and secondly to prevent the first posting on this topic, namely Athol's statement in broad terms "microlighters doing their utmost to disrupt the AGM".

Athol, firstly I invite you to elaborate on your wording "to disrupt" or explain why paid up members are not allowed to speak up at an AGM. Do you have a different version of AeCSA's Articles of Association ? My copy states freedom of speach.

Secondly, Aero Club Exco, why are you so silent since the AGM, yet a storm brewed around you ? Surely a pro-active press/e-mail release should have been apt ? Or are we in the same 2011/2012 boat untill the next AGM ? Maybe Avcom's DL is right after all, a lot of deadwood needs clearing. But that hurts.

Tese, Anti tese, Sin tese

Yours,
Pondering paying member.
Kloot
Roel

[gertcoetzee]

From the Aeroclub "Articles of Association":

7.5 The quorum for an Annual General Meeting or a Special General Meeting shall be Ordinary members from at least six Member Associations present in person or by proxy, provided that at least 20 Ordinary Members are present in person, and no business shall be transacted at any General Meeting unless the requisite quorum is present at the commencement of the meeting. Proxies shall be members of good standing and the proxy forms shall be in writing, signed by the nominator on the approved form and lodged with the Chairman or the Secretary before the meeting commences. Non-affiliated members present at a meeting shall not be counted for the purpose of establishing the existence of a quorum in that meeting.

From the discussion above, Aeroclub is sure to know MISASA's (and others') concerns. If they do not respond positively, give the MC the boot next year.

Why not start getting in those proxies now, for next years' AGM.

MISASA how about publishing a proxy form?

[alanmack]

Gert you have to be present too vote for the appointment of a member to the EXCO but for ordinary matters a proxy counts. We plan to publish proxies next year.

Thanks for the nudge.

[alanmack]

Gert you have to be present too vote for the appointment of a member to the EXCO but for ordinary matters a proxy counts. We plan to publish proxies next year.

Thanks for the nudge.

[kloot piloot]

Proxies are available online. Google Aeroclub Articles of Association.

[Asterix]

Are we not done yet on this topic? I see this thread gets longer and longer - (without of course any inputs from Athole - I assume he just reads the thread, getting madder and madder.. b Good.)

I think we end this debate and we just all pitch up next year at "The Meeting" and vote the "Old 1/10th Cessna Owners" out. Same owners can then write an article in "The Publication", which none of us will buy in any event. (Please don't forget - DO NOT BUY - just page through in CNA and put back on the shelve - not a lot of interesting stuff in any event - it should take you about two minutes. )

Having Hi-Jacked the AGM next year - as is befitting of us Thugs - we should be able to set the agenda for at least a couple of years>

Mayibuya 2013. Amandla! (and especially for you, Athole - . Democracy sucks, doesn't it? ) Forward Comrades to 2013 elections! Lets show these bloody agents!

[Loco]

Are we not done yet on this topic? I see this thread gets longer and longer - (without of course any inputs from Athole - I assume he just reads the thread, getting madder and madder.. b Good.)

I think we end this debate and we just all pitch up next year at "The Meeting" and vote the "Old 1/10th Cessna Owners" out. Same owners can then write an article in "The Publication", which none of us will buy in any event. (Please don't forget - DO NOT BUY - just page through in CNA and put back on the shelve - not a lot of interesting stuff in any event - it should take you about two minutes. )

Having Hi-Jacked the AGM next year - as is befitting of us Thugs - we should be able to set the agenda for at least a couple of years>

Mayibuya 2013. Amandla! (and especially for you, Athole - . Democracy sucks, doesn't it? ) Forward Comrades to 2013 elections! Lets show these bloody agents!

[kloot piloot]

(Please don't forget - DO NOT BUY - just page through in CNA and put back on the shelve - not a lot of interesting stuff in any event - it should take you about two minutes.

Oh my soul, you are over the top hilarious !

[John Boucher]

Negative on Alpha Pappa Oscar Lima Oscar Golf Yankee .... ?

[Athol Terence]

OK now so this thread is getting bogged down into 'I hate Athol' and all sorts of name calling.

I would like to apologise to ALL of the Microlight section for making the comment in the African Pilot newsletter two weeks ago and now please let’s move on.

You can bash the Aero Club all you want to, but please remember that when it comes to volunteer work, many people talk but don’t perform. Like your own committee, all the EXCO are volunteers. The AeCSA belongs to each of you so if you want to make meaningful change then I suggest you do this through your AeCSA representative who is your chairman. You have an excellent committee and they are the people you have elected to represent you at the EXCO forum. No one is going to get anywhere by calling for division within our ranks - only the authorities at the SA CAA and DOT, who are laughing at our squabbles.

This is just like South Africa politics where the tiny white minority fight amongst themselves for petty power and the BIG ANC party simply walks all over us with what is now close to a two thirds majority. If we stood together behind one significant party like the DA, the ANC would not achieve a two thirds majority. Enough of the politics, which I have just used for illustrative purposes.

The AeCSA has admitted that it has been reminisce about getting the FUNDI system up and running the way it should for ALL the sections. I happen to know that a high level meeting between your committee members and the AeCSA's management has already taken place and that a fix-it solution is presently being worked out. Please give this a chance and let’s move forward.

As far as African Pilot's policy about every section of the AeCSA is concerned - my magazine has always supported ALL of the sections and will continue to do so. Microlighting will become ever more popular in South Africa as General Aviation becomes more and more expensive - almost unaffordable. We all feel this and that is why I share my Cessna 182 in a syndicate. I really only use the Cessna for air-to-air photography and to commute to distant airshows for the magazine. Frankly there is nothing more exciting than flying in an open cockpit low and slow as per the other thread on this forum.

Lastly: I do not hold any official position on any aviation committee – not the AeCSA, EAA, Power Flying or CAASA. I am simply in a support role for these organisations of which I am a member.

I wish you all 'blue skies' and lots of fun with your particular sport. Should be wine glasses!

Regards,
Athol Terence.

[John Boucher]

Now you see Athol... that was not so difficult was it? I do suggest as I have before to think of the repercussions of what is being said as there is a backlash to the words "the pen is mightier than the sword" but Newton's Law 3 says "To every action there is always an equal and opposite reaction..." This brings balance to the issue.

To our members:
I work actively on the Fundi system and yes changes are being made and there is progress. I might add that we were unfairly branded of the stand we made iro Fundi system as I had to learn yesterday that some of the sub-section ADMINS have never even logged on to the system since it's inception. How then could a finger be pointed at us for being adamant about the shortcomings and you didn't even have any clue of how the system works? Also not stand up in the AGM and say that they haven't?

One of the issues that Brett, Aeroclub and I are experiencing is that of payment references. Immaterial to which account the fees have been paid, REFERENCES are either not put in or are incorrect. In the Fundi Payment system and to the sub-section accounts when doing an EFT the reference is VITAL. Retaining your proof of transfer in your aircraft or licence file is a must for future reference. We cannot just go on - man I know I paid..... Without the proof it just becomes impossible to resolve! All the more when you have not done an internet payment (ie. paid the fees in cash!)

[Air Hog]

I was also getting sick of this name calling. It is like calling someone a name because you were called a name. That way you just lower your standards to the same level of the other person. It does not solve the problem.

Let's do something constructive for a change. I support the cause! Not the name calling.