Old trike with 582 silver top or newer trike with 503?

[windswept]

Hi Guys,

I am new to trikes and truly enjoying the experience! I am looking at buying a trike but I am faced with a dilemna (Finances limited); Do I go for an older trike ie 1998 with 550 hours on a silver top 582, or do I rather buy a younger trike fitted with a 503 engine ie. 250 odd hours.

I will be flying the aircraft from microland in johannesburg mainly solo, but the odd occasion with a brave passenger! I am aware that density altitude has a dramatic effect on all engines and this is most definately more than a mere consideration, however, reading through posts on the forum, as well as the good old internet I have a concern with the crank issues affecting the Rotax 2 stroke engines.
It would seem as if (from what i have read) the 582 engine, particularly the silver top, has had more than its fair share of problems. From a novice perspective I would be led to believe that the 503 is a little more reliable than the older 582 and that it is not afflicted with many of the 582 issues.

The effect of altitude on performance also seems to be a little misunderstood in some posts; from my understanding there is a percentage drop in power from the engine thus; 582 producing 64hp with eg 23% reduction in performance = 49hp (15hp drop) whereas a 503 producing 50hp with 23% reduction = 39hp (11hp drop). The gap in performance starts to be narrowed. Before I get irrate replies, I am very aware that in a 503 you have started off with less power and margins are already minimum, hence my posting this in the first place.

Would the choice of propellor and the correct setting therof not also play a role. ie a 582 with poor prop versus a 503 with good prop?

Thanks for the help in advance........

[John Young]

Before I get irrate replies ....

Hi Windswept,

No irate replies on this Forum.

How much do you weigh?

Which wing comes with the 503 that you are looking at?

Go 503 'coz of finances unless your hamburger bashing exploits necessitate a 582 (blue top).

Regards
John ZU-sEXY

[windswept]

Thankfully I weigh 85kg (Used to be gravitationally gifted a few years ago!) I am looking at getting an Aquilla, with a 15sqm wing to compensate for the altitude. Speed is not really a major concern for me. If I want to go fast I think I will go in a taxi

My major concern with the silver top 582 is that from the postings it seems as if they are a little fragile. It does not help if you have the most powerful engine in the world if the thing is as reliable as a home affairs official

Another consideration is the structural integrity of an older aeroplane. When is a trike too old? etc.. Surely fatigue starts to play a role in older aircraft, however I have not found any accident reports or forum postings to give any weight to either sides of the argument. Any help?

[pierre]

See topic
Silver Top vs. Blue Top

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=9594&p=97652&hilit ... top#p97652

At the end it seems that there is only a heating problem between the blue top and silver top.

[Tumbleweed]

Since you're at Microland why don't you consider rather advertising for a share in an under-utilised low hour new trike. You might get a favourable response.

[windswept]

Will look into partnerships, but have been burned in tha past with tin planes so a little hesitant.

What constitutes an old trike though? Seems to me that trikes can live a very long life.

[Duck Rogers]

Do the maths anyway/anyhow you want, 49Hp still beats 39Hp...

[Stephan van Tonder]

Cranks are no worse on the 582 than the 503. Also doesn't HAVE to be replaced at 600hours - can check condition and continue
Trikes can go on to very high hours. There is a windlass at Petit in the flightschool that has done 1800 hours now. Just have the wing checked at say 800 hours and have the cables re-done etc. and new bolts or whatever items are found worn.

[AndyG]

Last I heard until a couple of years ago was that ZS - VOV (Windlass number 1 ) was still flying. I got to do quite a few hours on this aircraft some years ago. The point being is that if the craft is maintained and regular checks and replacements done on all necessary parts you should not have a problem. this includes wing fabric as well as the skeleton of the wing.

[Morph]

My choice is 582 then 503, just because you are at altitude. Down here at the sea the 503 is just perfect and bullet proof. There is nothing wrong with the silvertop, it works just fine.

If the crank does need to be replaced now you are looking at a beeg expense. So I would have this checked out as part of the deal. If the crank does need to be replaced I would look at the 503, which still has 500 hours (5 years) before this expense

[windswept]

It would definately seem that the level / quality of maintenance plays a very big part in the longevity of the aircraft - obviously!

However a very disturbing trend that I have come across with many of the aircraft I have seen is that the aircraft hours dont match the actual aircraft state. One guy had more hours in his logbook than those in the aircraft logbook - on the same plane! When I queried this he told me that the hobbs had been faulty for a while and had taken a while to replace.This was not just a few hours - try almost double! Scary stuff.

[kloot piloot]

iF YOU WEIGH 85 AND (oops,shouting) mainly intend to fly on your own, then nothing wrong with 503.

Common sence prevails with "love at first sight" versus "doubt at first sight". You should immediately know whether the trike had a lcaring owner, e.g. condition of an up-to-date logbook, condition of footrest rubbers and wing bungees, cable hood rubbers on carbs etc. These are small items, but takes time to replace. If they are new, the previous owner had the time to attend to detail.

Nothing wrong with a well cared for 503 or 582 (silver top) and a not-too-faded wing.

Happy venturing !

[Low Level]

Last I heard until a couple of years ago was that ZS - VOV (Windlass number 1 ) was still flying.

ZS-VOV visited us at Rhino for the Cosmos run four weeks ago, flying from Middelburg. Was quite impressed to find out it is Windlass no.1. Cannot believe I do not have a picture of it. .

Maybe JFK can post us one.

[windswept]

The fact that the aircraft is flying definately removes doubt as to how long a trike can be 'useful'

If that trike could talk.........

[Wargames]

If that trike could talk.........

Or then again ..... maybe not!