Part 24 : First issue to debate.

[RudiGreyling]

Guys and Fairy Flycatcher,

What about the way LSA is handled in the US (especially since half of the developed world seems to be adopting the same regs now).

There are 2 categories - SLSA (Special LSA) and ELSA (Experimental LSA). My understanding is that ELSA (basically any "home built" LSA where you did more than 51% of the construction) you can do all the maintenance, the thinking being that you are the most qualified since you built the aircraft.

However, if you bought your LSA (whether built by a factory or by another home builder), then it is a you may not do any maintenance. To do basic line maintenance (Plugs Oil etc) you need to go on a 16 hour course. You then get your certificate and off you go. This also qualifies you to remove the engine and send it to a service centre for example, but not to do a full overhaul yourself (That's heavy maintenance).

I have been on the Line Maintenance course offered by Rattex SA, and it is well worth it. I feel much more comfortable doing the basics now. I believe this sort of process would work well here, and would also cater for the sort of thing George is talking about.

Sonex, I Agree!

[African Grey]

Microlight Pilots should definately be allowed to do own maintainence....if hes' uncomfortable, then sure use an AP / AMO.

Got back form Kuruman last night, pilot there was quoted by an AMO R26000 for (engine parts) only for a 582 overhaul..... A complete kit from aviation engines is only R14000.....!

This is what's going to happen if the law goes unchallenged....

[lamercyfly]

Hi folk.

Just to add my view, which should be obvious

I am fully in favour of freedom of choice. I believe part of the essence of microlighting is owner 'tinkering'.......Whether that tinkering stops at spark-plug changes, or goes on to a full blown major overhaul using internet help pages or your 'mate-next-door' or choosing to request your local motorcycle 2-stroke mechanic to help........it's all your choice.......

No laws with regard to this........

No compulsory line maintenance, no supervision direct or otherwise etc., If you want to do a line maintenance course, great......your choice.......Not a law.........Minimum laws, cause the insurance industry will screw you when the day comes, using laws that you did not know existed.

Just plain owner repairs and or maintenance..............

Obviously Annual Inspections still by AP...........

Later,

David

[John Young]

Just plain owner repairs and or maintenance..............

Obviously Annual Inspections still by AP...........

Agree 100%

Regards
John ZU-CIB

[cobra]

Agreed

Although there are various tech minded MPL pilots out there, we should be fair to ourselves and try and put flight safety issues first and money issues second. How many of use owns a torque wrench

I believe that we are all capable of doing a thorough pre-flight, changing the plugs, air and fuel filters and ... well that is about it.

It may be that 10% of MPLs will be able the service/repair/replace engine comp blind folded and the rest of the 90%, well we are happy just changing the plugs and filters. Should we want to move outside the scope of "light maint ??" do a course and receive a certification, have the equipment, and be certified to do so even may it be regulated according to a schedule and CAA regulations.

It seems that AVIATION=law+regulations+certification+schedules+CASH = SAFETY

If we have a problem with costs and unfair manufactures schedules, this is another debate.

Follow the link below and dl the manual, the first 7 pages and 21-27, interest reading

http://www.airborne.com.au/pages/manuals.html

XT-582 Maintenance Manual - 11.08Mb download

[Tumbleweed]

I believe that we are all capable of doing a thorough pre-flight, changing the plugs, air and fuel filters and ... well that is about it.

I agree. The AP inpection does not include running the motor, setting brakes e.t.c. and appears only to check structural and mounting integrity.

Could we not identify / include / endorse owners / instructors who are competant to carry out tasks more mechanically meaningfull and have the AP endorse them to be competant?

A simple scenario could be " Hey Koos, come and share a coke here while I change the plugs and while we're talking k@k, have a squiss at my carb, take it for a circuit and see if the brakes / rattle is OK"

This probably (and in my case is) takes place anyway and if a bottle, breakfast, loan my trike, money changes hands so what?

This will accomodate the maintenance abled/ maintenance dummies as well as the guys far from an AP and can just formalise a procedure, elliminate a formal AP R 400.00 maintenence but not interfere with the annual AP inspection.

Obviously open to abuse, but if self regulation includes flying dangerously anyway, whats the difference?

[cobra]

..
Could we not identify / include / endorse owners / instructors who are competant to carry out tasks more mechanically meaningfull and have the AP endorse them to be competant?..

Could an AP respond with a list

[lamercyfly]

you guys are talking the line maintenance course which may only be offered by Rotax approved agencies..........

I fully endorse pilots attending a line maintenance course.

But, I have seen folk who have attended these courses still quite ignorant. The course will not make a mechanic of you unless you are already mechanically inclined, in which case you do not need the course.

What is even MORE important, in my opinion, and which is hugely overlooked, is the ability to strip down and rebuilt your wing. Now, like I said before, an engine failure in a trike is not really a problem, but a structural failure of any part of the wing.......Aish.........

Anyway, folk, please don't digress from the topic........Do we want the choice of owner maintenance. Keep focused please..... By all means motivate your choice, but then the guys answering, please don't debate.
The topic is purely a channel for independant thought and choice. Maybe on a new topic, on the Hangar Talk page, you can thrash it out and debate it to death.

But on this page, just individual opinions please, no debating..........

Thanks.

[Morph]

Do we want the choice of owner maintenance.

This is the essense, I want the choice.

[lamercyfly]

Yo Morph.......have you cast your vote

Regards, and thanks for all your input and contribution to the forum.

[Boet]

Just plain owner repairs and or maintenance..............

Obviously Annual Inspections still by AP...........

Agree 100%

Regards
John ZU-CIB

SO DO I. :D

[Boet]

Because:

1. We are not allowed to fly over built up areas
2. We do not & never have posed any serious threat to the lives of the innocent minding their own business on the ground

we should be allowed to carry out our own services & maintenance without any supervision and to our own discretion.

If we have to comply with the new legislation, then we should receive the right & the benefit to fly over built up areas & operate from there like other aircraft are allowed to do.

Henni

Hennie jy slaan die spyker OP sy kop. Agree with you 100%. Doc LS1 worked just fine. Every change is not nessecarily an improvement. I deem all these changes just a move by the burocracy to milk more money from us. I am not amused or amazed by the large number of NTCA suddenly glutting the second hand market. We are loosing too many of our valuable old members, and not enough new blood to replace them.
The best move would probably have been to take away the running of the NTCA afairs from CAA, and letting Aero Club do it?? What happened to the idea??

[Morph]

Yo Morph.......have you cast your vote

Of course I have, Numero Uno, but hey there is no harm in campaiging for support . I promise not to vote again, but you will never shut me up

[Barnstormer]

Have ground school this evening. Taking the notebook along to sign all the guys up and get them to vote!

They all prefer own maintenance, but they have to make there voices heard!

I always take a filter coffee thingamajig with to brew some hot stuff for the other class mates (and apples does not work for these teachers). I'll use it as bait this time. No sign-up and vote, no coffee...

[Beaver 550]

Yes i would like to do my own maintenance. The AMO's have an comercial intrest and and has to satisfy the SACAA paper trail. I just had an 4 hour SACAA audit i will tell you where there intrest is if you want to know. The surpliers have a comercial intrest. The orginisation that i pay a yearly subscription to has its own agenda and does not seem act in my intrest if the want to kill grass roots flying they are doing a good job of it. I have an very good AP that does my anuals. I am an AME for 30 years and i like the idea of someone other than myself to linspect my aircraft. I have an interest in my own safety. and veryPi@@ed off.