SAGPA and Aero Club

[gyrosa]

Tonight we had our first meeting primarily to pick up where the old committee left off and to try and plan our way forward.
All the members of the committee are unified in that we want to unify the gyroplane community. We also need to do the following this year:-
1. Complete the MOP/ARO (a legal requirement by the SACAA and RAASA)
2. Arrange an AP seminar (maybe even 2)
3. Arrange an instructor's seminar
4. Draw up an events calender (next event is at Kittyhawk on the 4th of December)
5. Next meeting of the committee will take place on the 4th of December.
Other matters discussed were how the monetary matters would be handled and the North to South event on the 20th. Information, such as altitudes, joining procedures etc regarding the event on the 20th will be given out soon to all participants.
At the SAGPA AGM it was decided to keep the SAGPA subs as the where in 2009 and this was again confirmed by the new committee. I have to inform you though that the Aero Club does need to increase it's subs slightly.
It is our intention to upgrade the website as well as prepare a facebook on the internet for our members where photos and relevant information may be posted.
We will welcome comments from members and will attempt, wherever possible, to make this year a safe and prosperous year for all our members and also to seek out new members for SAGPA.
Best regards
Eric

[t-bird]

Hi Eric

The canning of SAGPA's website was suggested on the AGM with microlighters as the replacement.

[mak]

t-bird

I don't know if you attended the AGM, but that wasn't the discussion or decision at the AGM. According to me (someone can correct me if I understood it wrong) the dicision was that the role of the SAGPA website would change (not terminate) and would be used to provide mostly information (to it's members & the public). The managers of this website were urged to keep it updated / current at all times. Microlighters would then be used for discussions or whatever k@k we all do here.

[gyrosa]

At the meeting we discussed the update of the website as a tool to draw interest. One must remember that the forum we are using does not really draw the person who is searching the web for gyros in South Africa in particular to any information. It was started essentially as a microlighters forum.
The website must contain factual, non argumentative, non biased information as well as articles of interest such as tours, photos, ie something that makes gyros in South Africa attractive to the new comer. It is also available as a tool for adverts, which in turn reduces the cost of running the website.
We are also striving to unite gyro plane pilots in South Africa and expand our sport in any possible manner that we can. Our aim is to stop this "mine is better than yours argumentative attitude" that has been going on for way too long now and rather strive toward a more positive outlook toward ALL gyros available in South Africa
Anybody that has been looking at the forum for the last two years (and that includes ourselves) will realise that we have done untold damage to our own image by going on in the "mine is better than yours argumentative attitude". Let us make an effort to be more positive to our sport, more tolerant to other types of gyros and give each other support and breathing space. Never again must we read long arguments of two or more persons bickering over the pro's and con's of particular gyros but rather guide the person or person seeking information to the right persons for first hand information.
At the moment the sport is very quite in sales of both new and/or second hand gyros and we have all had a hand in this with our bickering.
Remember, there are many reasons that will bring about a sale of a gyro. The main reason is probably price and what one person can afford is not necessarily the price that the other can afford, but the bottom line is that we all enjoy the sport in one form or another.
Let us stand united in promoting our sport as a whole, irrespective of differences (arguments) of opinions on types.

[gyrosa]

Again the issue of registration letters on our gyros has hit the floor from the SACAA. Guys, many of us are not displaying registration letters as per the law. I will be meeting with the SACAA in the next few working days to get information/dispensation etc in this regard and will post the information here.
Let all get legal please, and obey the law.
Regards
Eric

[t-bird]

Ai here we go again.

Mak I was at the AGM and sat next to Weidi – “Magnificant” in front of Johan Meyer next to Johnny

That was definitely mentioned.

Eric how many hits does the Sagpa Website have compared to mircrolighters ?

Interesting you say that “such as tours, photos, ie something that makes gyros in South Africa attractive to the new comer”

How many interesting articles did YOU write on any of these websites ??

How many positive post did YOU do ? – Please feel free to attached them here are some of mine

My first trip on sagpa 4125 hits over 4 years
http://sagpa.co.za/sagpa/index.php?opti ... &Itemid=62

Trips on microlighters

Best flying in 450 hours 1400 hits from the 20 july
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=13635

Trip to Lichtenburg 450 hits
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=9538

Bushveld trip
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=9466

Gauteng to Margate in 2 days
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=7614

1150 km two magni and a Ela 2624 hits in 2 3 years
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=5540


You said “It is also available as a tool for adverts, which in turn reduces the cost of running the website.”
What is the net situation ? Advertising income less cost of website ??

It is possible to have a commercial section under microlighters.

[Learjet]

Completely support Eric's approach to the website and a more united gyro community.

If you were a newby prospective gyro pilot searching the web to find out more about gyros would you really want your first introduction to our gyro community to be as per the post above?

Also, as much as I enjoy the microlighters forum (and microlights in general) gyroplanes are NOT "microlights" and I do not hesitate to make this point clear when dealing with ignorant ATC's or any other person who makes reference to them as such.

Whilst I really enjoy this forum, there's no question that there is a very good case for the continuation of a stand-alone (but better managed) SAGPA website.

[Jabbanaught]

Completely support Eric's approach to the website and a more united gyro community.

If you were a newby prospective gyro pilot searching the web to find out more about gyros would you really want your first introduction to our gyro community to be as per the post above?

Also, as much as I enjoy the microlighters forum (and microlights in general) gyroplanes are NOT "microlights" and I do not hesitate to make this point clear when dealing with ignorant ATC's or any other person who makes reference to them as such.

Whilst I really enjoy this forum, there's no question that there is a very good case for the continuation of a stand-alone (but better managed) SAGPA website.

Well Said

[t-bird]

Hi Learjet

I respect your opinion as you have made very informative posts in the past.

You said “If you were a newby prospective gyro pilot searching the web to find out more about gyros would you really want your first introduction to our gyro community to be as per the post above? ”

Maybe if you click on the links you will change your mind.

I will remove the post if you think it does not contribute – Just say remove it with reasons.

My point is that I have posted trips on both website – it was always available to everyone not a new thing.

Better management of SAGPA website comes with financial cost and an individual’s time. Can we really justify it for an organisation the size of SAGPA where there are only say 200 members ? – don’t know the total number of members.

It just surprise me that Eric made the comment “non biased information as well as articles of interest such as tours, photos, ie something that makes gyros in South Africa attractive to the new comer.”

But I still need to see a positive post from his side.

[Learjet]

Great gyro trip pics t-bird! Please post more Regarding the SAGPA website vs microlighters I think there is a place for both. I always think of this forum as our "kroeg" where we can joke, talk, debate gyro flying, gyro politics and gyro sex (will the side-by-side gyro okes please start a thread!), gooi mielies and bliksem the donner who flew too low over the dorp kerk last Sunday... and the SAGPA website as our "voorkamer".

I have no idea about the costs to host the SAGPA website but I'd rather my membership money was being spent on an informative website promoting gyro aviation (with lekker gyro trip pics) to interested new folk then being spent on the AGM booze bill (dis n grap julle!). Anyway lets see what the new committe decides. They've kindly volunteered their time and skills to do the job (for free!) so lets put any personal differences aside and give them a chance to put their plans into action.

[Morph]

You need both

as Dave said, this is the spot where the hangar talk occurs. I hear that "microlighters" as a url does not describe what you do, but this is merely a forum used to throw ideas around. Anybody can start their own forum, but then you are just creating another "mine is better than yours" scenario. BTW have you noticed that nowhere else on the (microlighters) forum does this "mine is better than yours" quandry exist. It is lekker that all forms of NPL flying is discussed here, because we all share the same sky, the same flyins etc. We know you have your own needs, hence the dedicated sub-forum.

You also need a specialised SAGPA forum, with reference material, membership information, minutes of the last meeting, etc, specific to your sport, as Misasa is specific to mine. They can never be the same thing.

Good luck is whatever decision you make.

[t-bird]

Hi Morph

I see your point but would it be possible to have subsections on Microlighters under Gyros for SAGPA issues minutes etc .
I would rather see my SAGPA money going to Microlighters than a website that no one visits.

Subsection for AGM’s
With minutes and dates underneath it

Events

SAGPA is so up to date they have under aircraft review Magni m 16 and Ela 07 . Come to mircolighters and read all about the Xenon and Magni m22 MT03


Learjet I think that Microlighters do more in promoting gyro’s than SAGPA – but that is my opinion.

[Learjet]

would it be possible to have subsections on Microlighters under Gyros for SAGPA issues minutes etc .

This is an excellent suggestion t-bird!

Learjet I think that Microlighters do more in promoting gyro’s than SAGPA – but that is my opinion.

t-bird - I agree with you 100%, and I've also been very outspoken in the past about what I felt were some serious shortcomings of SAGPA. But there's a new committe and so what's in the past must become "water under the bridge." Gyros are one of the fastest growing and increasingly popular sectors of aviation in South Africa (the number of gyro pilots in the Western Cape alone has more than quadrupled in the past couple of years!) Unfortunately this also means that we no longer fly "under the radar" so to speak and that if our gyro flying interests are to be protected from the "make some more rules to collect some more bucks" authorities than we need to set aside our personal differences and unite behind SAGPA and the elected committee.

[Morph]

I see your point but would it be possible to have subsections on Microlighters under Gyros for SAGPA issues minutes etc .

Yes this is possible. Look at Hangar Talk and you will see the sub forum at the top

CAA require you to belong to an ARO. SAPGA are your ARO. You will not be able to get your Gyro AP's without being a member, plus they are supposed to represent you at CAA

[gyrosa]

T-Bird,
First and foremost I want to stress the issue, we have to unite gyros in South Africa.
You as a member of SAGPA want the sport to grow, so help and allow us to do this in a positive manner.
We need to have a window for the new comer, hence the reason to continue the website.
This thread has been set to supply information as to what is going on with Aero Club and SAGPA meetings and NOT, I repeat NOT, as a bickering and argumentative point whereby, you especially, can have an issue on every thing that is done, stated and run out of context.
Please by all means comment, ask questions etc that are meaningful and constructive, and we will try to do something about it.
With regards to issues that I have sent in to SAGPA, there are none. I have sent in my articles years ago to SA Flyer etc, and do not have the time at present to part take in fly aways etc. My last tour was 2006 down the west coast and round to Plett before heading back to JHB.