Training for game counting, farms, ranch etc.

[Nkwazi]

"Have any of you heard of people hunting out of a trike?? I would like to give a try one day, but I still have not figured out the theory behind it. Some advice would be nice."

Immoral and unethical, just like shooting from the back of a bakkie, at a waterhole, at night with a spotlight or from a hide.

Thats why its called hunting and not shooting. If you want to hunt, hunt with morals and ethics.

[lefssa]

Shooing from an aircraft without a permit is illegal. It is regarded as an act of war and you can be prosecuted for it

[Wart]

... in the pen with the lions...

Is this a breeding program or for hunting?

[Wargames]

... in the pen with the lions...

Is this a breeding program or for hunting?

I think yank need to learn to shoot out of aerie!! Not for hunting, but to clear landing strip of lions when he has a engine out over the pen.

As they say: "Eat or be Eaten!!"

[Nkwazi]

Most "lion breeding programs" are for the benefit of the canned hunting industry so that some stupid American or European "hunter" can come to Africa and target practice at a lion that has been bred to be shot. How difficult is it to shoot an animal from a hide or bait?? If you can shoot straight, you cant fail. We dont need to captive breed lions, they are not endangered. I hope that Martinus van Schalkwyk has the balls to implement the ban - I doubt it though.

Sorry, it makes me very angry

[Guzz]

Before I had my MPL, I was visiting a friend on a farm in the North. He got a call from one of the neighbours asking to help look for an Eland that was shot and wounded the previous day. All ground searches failed, so they took to the skies, saw the wounded animal, and with one shot by the PH from the trike, dropped the Eland with a shot between the horns...

I'm not saying that hunting from a trike is a good idea, but when needed, can be a great help. 2ndly, only to be done by a pro!

*G

[Wargames]

Most "lion breeding programs" are for the benefit of the canned hunting industry so that some stupid American or European "hunter" can come to Africa and target practice at a lion that has been bred to be shot. How difficult is it to shoot an animal from a hide or bait?? If you can shoot straight, you cant fail. We dont need to captive breed lions, they are not endangered. I hope that Martinus van Schalkwyk has the balls to implement the ban - I doubt it though.

Sorry, it makes me very angry

Totally agreed

But what do expect from guys that spend more on cammo wear than on coaching to shoot well. There is no fun in the killing of an animal, but more on the adventure and then on the art of shooting. Many oaks are very pride on a shot of 200m, but there is no trick in it. Most guns are set at 200m. So it is merely a "mik en druk".

'nough said.

Safe Shooting.

[tsotsi]

Canned hunting is appalling!

Smaak to watch Hunter Hunted

[RudiGreyling]

Hi, Ditto on what most said.

1) Do one camp at a time
2) Fly with GPS to ensure you zig zag entire camp.
3) Get passenger to do actual counting
4) Pilot to concentrate only on flying ZIG ZAG pattern and monitor engine vitals vigorously.
5) Get passenger to take digital pictures of herds
6) Pilot needs to fly low enough to scare animals, you only see them when they move, to high and you don't notice them
7) Fly with HELMETS and full flight suite!!!

Due to low flying in dangerous terrain and few landing spots this is a VERY DANGEROUS pass time. Friend of mine has scars to proof, without helmet would have been dead.

[RV4ker (RIP)]

Agree with all said so far.

Also watch airspeed and wind. Downwind turns catch even guys with 20'000hrs. Do not be tempted to "just quickly" anything.

We have used video camera successfully in the past. Concentrate on flying the "PRE PLANNED" flight path over the camp and worry about what you see later. We had 3 vid camera's (Front down, right and left side at angles and then Pax had 1 for mik en druk.) Once back on ground play all the vid camera's using same remote and they all pause together when you press pause... Very nifty as you then have panoramic view if you set up all the TV's alongside each other.

I found counting from the aerie a bit counter productive as space is tight and limited place to write, take pics, think & fart. Also when pax get all the data gets green & yellow (and you tend to count carrots rather than animals) and the ink tends to run. (Assume in trike it the Pieloot that will adorn the technicolour poncho...)

Bottom line. Plan it on the ground and make sure you know what you are trying to achieve. Animals will move and thus video vs camera is a real winner and (if possible) allows you to track the heard and reduce double counting). Vid's also nice to judge growth of the little ones...

2c...

PS
We had a couple "boys" set out on trike to hunt a couple poachers (Scare them rather than kill them). Returned missing left wheel of the trike (which was apparently shot off with rock salt concoction used in doublewalkinghailgun..... BE CAREFUL OUT THERE...

[Stan]

Firstly, canned hunting is banned by regulations which came into power on 1 February. According to the same regulations it is illegal to breed lions specifically for hunting.

A number of years ago I did some research into the use of microlights for aerial surveys. I do this kind of work for the provincial coservation department and have plenty of experience with the use of helicopters.
Microlights are fine for smaller properties as the time you can fly is limited. The time of day that you do the counts is a problem as early morning light tends to make some species disappear depending on how they stand. Impala and giraffe disappear very easily. I have already battled to find giraffe that I knew were standing at a spot among the trees (open bushveld). I have not had problems counting wildebeest but blesbok gap it to the other end of the farm when they hear a Rotex engine.

I did the research when GPS's were expensive and used other navigation methods. now you can get a PDA with built in GPS and mapping system as well as a spreadsheet function and bob's your uncle. In helicopters we use a GPS linked to a laptop with appropriate census software which shows where you are flying, what you have seen, where they were, etc. It makes life a lot easier than when I first started doing surveys.

Your flight lines must be parallel to each other and approximately300 meters apart so that you can count 150 meters each side. Fly at a height that you can comfortably see 150 meters each side. The length of each leg must be the shortest possible between fences, barriers, whatever limits the game movements. This will help reduce overcounts.

The use of cameras is a good idea. We use them to count large herds of animals.

The pilot flies, navigates and spots game while the passenger counts and records the game.

This method will give you trends in populations as it is not very accurate (the fault in counting must be the same for each count). The advantage is that it is relatively cheap which allows you to do a number of counts over the same area and get a more accurate result.
Four pairs of eyes is better than two but the difference in costs is about R6000/hour for chopper as opposed to R300/hour for microlight makes the desicion quite easy.

If anybody wants to discuss this, send me a pm and I will let you have my contact details.

Stan

[John Young]

Firstly, canned hunting is banned by regulations which came into power on 1 February. According to the same regulations it is illegal to breed lions specifically for hunting.

Would you believe R ?? 000 to shoot a tame white rhino (as aggressive as a cow)?

Would you believe R ?? 000 to shoot a drugged lioness trapped in a half-acre pen?

Makes me

And then the "ou's" stick a foot on it to pose for a photo - Eish

No regards
John ZU-CIB

[Slow_Poke]

Ditto Rudi, i do exactly the same

I fly and monitor the engine and check the track on gps (i normally do 3 runs 90 degrees to one another - +/- 100meters appart- usually start off South - North, then East-West and South-North again, depending on wind and size of camp/farm to be counted) and let the pax (usually my friend the 'wild life vet' ) do the counting - i'll help spot if possible.

I start of the sortie by flying the perimeter of the farm / camp, making a mental note of any obstacles, roads, fences, high trees, 'wind pompe' in the kalahari ect - just get a feel for the terain you will be flying over. Usually take the owner with, if not, he supplies me with a map of the farm.

I usually maintain 150ft(very dangerous) - 200ft and bar neutral. I overfly the border fence and do a climbing turn and descending back on the next track. I use a clipboard with a laminated counting sheet - tied to the trike of course - with the different species available on the farm & permanent marker pen.

A mark is made next to the specie for every animal counted. I repeat the whole process 3 times and compare the figures between the 3 runs - if there is a big variance - somethings wrog and has to be checked. It is nearly impossible to gice the numbers based on sex - bull/cow ect.

It is also very important that the person counting has a good 'eye' for spotting animals on the ground - whole different balgame than spotting them from the ground!!

Also keep the spotter/counter informed when you are crossing the fence and when you are going to turn/climb/descend - they might feel uncomfortable and as they are constantly looking at the ground, could become disorientated quite easily.

Camera's a good idea, and i found that climbing (200ft-300ft) and orbitting overhead a bigger herd also works if you do not have a camera available.

Most Important - Safety First Always have a lookout for a place to land as there is not much time should anything happen. Also watch what the wind is doing the whole time! you could land up in a lot of mess so low/close to the ground if the wind cathes you out!

Just mu 2c worth.

[powerfly]

How about paint ball shooting from a trike?

[Morph]

Why is YankinSA so quiet

Did we touch a nerve here