ROTAX REPLACEMENT WANTED

[JACO]

Hi All

I'm in the market for a new engine for my trike , and wondered if you can help to put me in contact with people in South Africa who has any experiance with BMW, Hirth, HKS, Suzuki, Subaru, Yamaha, or any other engine successfully used

What has beeen done, where and by who ?
I'll need something that is easy to fit/modify,
and CAA papaerwork allready done will help.

Thanx All

[windswept]

Hi Jaco,

There are many different engine options available (some seem to be more publisised / succesful than others) with the most visible being Oupa-G's modification of a BMW GS motor which has been installed on a couple of aircraft. You can follow the development of the engine as well as the Safari it is fitted to at the following link: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=8397

There is also a story about the Yaris engine - just search the topic. Happy searching!

I know that a BMW motor has been fitted to a Solo Wings product, but I think the maiden flight is still pending.

I personally can't wait for alternative aero engines to be made available in a more mainstream fashion as the prices for overhauls and replacement of current types have become ridiculous.

[Yamaha1]

There is a new kid on the block in Europe - the UL 260i - like a fuel injected 912 - and reports are that it's a very nice engine.

http://www.ulpower.com/

Take a read - no longer is Rotax the only viable option!!

Mike

[neandertaler]

I would love to see a cheap, fuel saving replacement for the 582, as the HKS 700e engine is around 10000 Euros or 11500 ZAR here in Germany - more than the value of my trike!
I'm thinking of the conversion of a standard, large series production engine like the BMWs. Just lighter and with less power.

Cheers,

Oliver

[Stephan van Tonder]

I also had a look at theUL but it ain't cheap and the reports are not all that favourable at the moment. I think everybody wishes that somebody else will enter the market. I keep hoping another mass manufacturer like yamaha which would maybe keep the cost down.

[Morph]

Saturday afternoon a few of us sat in the bar at Morning Star and discussed this very thing and the basic consensus was, stick with Rotax.

I know that there is a huge move away from these engines, due to exorbitant prices but bear with me for a moment.

You do not want to be at the bleeding edge.

BMW conversion
If you have the resources (i.e. Ystervark and Vliegvark) that Oupa-G has then by all means go the BMW route. They are still finalising the mapping of the ignition and still need to prove reliability.

Hirth
Nothing but bad news IMHO

HKS
Heard that the support is not up to scratch, and the 582 has a better power to weight ratio for the same 65 horses

Yaris
Too new, unproven

Saburu
too heavy and complicated

Yamaha
unknown

Suzuki
Unknown

VW conversions
In most cases a pain in the arse.

There is simply nothing on the market with the same level of worry free reliability as the Rotax range. You look after it, do the required maintenance and most importantly give it good fuel and you have bullet proof motors. Everything else is experimental and as such you are prone to engine outs etc.

[Bugwar]

That is just the issue : nothing else has been proven IN THE AIR or has the customer base and support structure like Rotax.

Yamaha XT500 i.e is probably the most bulletproof engine I know of (not saying it will work on a plane) and there may be others but it has not been used in aeroplanes as extensively as the Rotax. So unless some fearless pioneers start flying a new engine and the support and customer base grow, it will never be competition for Rotax.

[neandertaler]

I think that there are quite a few motorbikes engines out there which would perfectly meet the requirements of us pilots and which are well engineered, proven and built in cheap mass production. However, when you have a closer look at them, the BMW boxer engines are currently the only motorbike engines with a separate gearbox and a good weight to power ratio. (At least as far as I know)
Especially when I look at motorbike carburettor engines it should be pretty easy to install them in a trike - if they wouldn't have the gearbox built in. For example the Suzuki 600 Bandit engine would look good as a replacement for the 582 - the motorbikes were cheap, sold in large quantities and the engine provides 78 hp.


Cheers,

Oliver

[Morph]

The problem with bike engines (excluding the BMW Boxers and the Vtwins), is they rev too high. their peak power band is in the upper say 10,000rpm. I had a Honda Blackbird that revved up to 13000. At those revs the engine is howling, the fuel is disappearing, and you will need a 5:1 gearbox to slow the prop down sufficiently. For a 4 stroke engine you ideally want something that will have it's peak power at about 5000prm if geared and 2500rpm if not. Not many bikes fit that one.

[Boet]

Try a Hardly Dangerous engine. Lots of torque at low revs.

[windswept]

Many engines are out there... I just find it hard to believe that someone somewhere has not designed a custom built aero engine at a reasonable price. Just look at the Jabiru motor, It seemed to come from nowhere and has become a rather mainstream engine. I was actually surprised at the price of a new one!.

When an established manufacturer like KFA actually make the effort to use it you have to wonder...

I think any engine depends on how you treat it from the word go. If the conversion/design is poor you already have problems brewing. Even when the engine has been properly converted/designed it still requires proper installation and then a proper breakin procedure needs to be followed. After all this the ongoing maintenance must be good and regular.

I have seen guys intall R500 000-00 continentals into aircraft and then rush the breakin process resulting in a very unreliable and maintenace hungry engine.

I cant wait for alternatives, but it does take time.

[Mogas]

Jabiru is top of the Rotax alternative list for me, untill Oupa has completed all the R&D on the Beemer.
I was pleasantly surprised at how well the 2200 performed in our Explorer.
I have to say that support from our agent in SA was pretty poor to say the least but we got through the couple of niggles we had without their help anyway.
IMHO this engine is the best value for money at the moment.
Mogas

[windswept]

That is most definately another major problem - Backup SERVICE. Many suppliers only seem to get MY Backup!

[Morph]

Jabiru is top of the Rotax alternative list for me

Has anybody installed one of these in a trike?

[windswept]

I have not heard anything yet, but I imagine that cooling will be a major concern in a pusher configuration Jabiru install.