Microlighters

On my way home from work, I stopped at Aviation Engines for a few spares for my plane.

One of the things on my list was an o-ring for a 'b' box. The help disappeared into the back and returned some minutes later with the required parts and an invoice.

I didn't need much and could not understand why the invoice was so high. On close inspection, I noticed that I had been charged R52.23 ex VAT for the o-ring.

I glanced up at the help and commented 'R52.23 for an o-ring, you're having a laugh aren't you'.
'No', came the indignant reply, 'it is a genuine Rotax part, Sir'.

I looked at the packaging. The o-ring was in a small, sealed plastic bag. The sealed seams were so poor that a 3 year old child with a cigarette lighter could have done a better job, and from that alone, I think I can safely make the assumption that the Rotax factory has no idea of the existance of the item.

Still realing from the shock of the price and the blatant untruth that had just been thrown at me, the only thing I could think of was to say 'That o-ring is no more a genuine Rotax part than I am. You can take that thing back because it is not worth any more than R5.00. I will go to my local bearing and seal agent and source it there. You guys are just pulling the f%@#ing ring out of it'.

I paid for the other parts I required and left Aviation Engines in a particularly bad mood.

I continued my journey homeward, with a short detour to Varco Industrial Products in Benoni. Bearing in mind that I was still suffering from a less than amiable demeanour, I waited for what seemed an age to be served. In time, a dark skinned bearded gentleman came scurrying round the corner, his faced slashed by a white toothed smile.
'How may I help you?' came the polite request.

It was at this juncture that I realised that I had no idea what size o-ring I required. With the certainty of fledgeling taking its first flight, I boldly stated, 'an o-ring 76mm ID by 3.5mm, please.'

The gentleman vanished round the corner and reappeared a minute later cluthing the afore mentioned o-ring. At a glance, I could see that my estimate was incorrect. Again I requested another item, this time 76mm by 3mm. A minute later the smiling man was back in front of me with the item I had requested.

'How much do I owe you,' was my question. 'Not a penny!' came the reply. 'Have a good day, sir.'

I thanked the man profusely and headed for home.

When I eventually made it home, I thought it prudent to check my workshop manual to make sure that I had indeeed got the right item. To my disgust, I discovered that I hadn't and that I needed a 75mm by 2.5mm o-ring.

The following day on my return from Pretoria, I again stopped at Varco and explained to the same gentleman that I had in fact made a huge cock up the previous day. Again he vanished and reappered a minute later with a 75mm by 2.5mm o-ring in hand.

'How much?' I asked and again the reply came, 'Nothing Sir, it is just an o-ring and the cost would not warrant the printing of an invoice.'
Given that he had supplied me with 2 o-rings the previous day at no charge, I whipped out my wallet and extracted a R10.00 note which I duly proffered saying, 'if you will not charge me, please take this money and give it to a charity of your choice.'
'Sir,' said the gentleman, 'you keep the money and give it to a charity of YOUR choice.' :D :D :D

SCARY......

Thanks for the heads up

I also had similar experience with the same company.I bought a rediator cap for more than R250 from them, and the same one cost at Midas R7.50.
Then they say you must support them!!!

This is a free market and it is your choice entirely to buy from them or not.

I remember this subject rearing it's head ages ago and I did a quick search on international rotax spares suppliers like http://www.ultralightnews.ca and Aircraft Spruce (http://www.aircraftspruce.com) and the prices quoted locally are comparable. I have bought directly from internationals and the dollar price needs to be multiplied by 10 to 11 to get the landed price in rands (1$=R7 plus shipping and VAT).

The rip-off is coming from Rotax and not the local agent.

I too look for a local equivalent first before having to buy the original which is OEM'd from the same company anyway. Especially when it comes to bearings and seals, radiators and coolers. I saved R5K on my Bush Baby radiator and oil cooler by going local (got both for R1200 from Silverton, give them the spec and they make it up for you)

I have a slight leak in the the water expansion tank (the little alu bottle with the pressure cap) and was quoted R2000 for a replacement. I will rather take it to a local repair shop and have them weld up the leak.

R 600 for a needle and seat. I can't see the intrinsic value exceeding R 100.

Only sold as a set. Seat can't wear out so double x double whammy.

Not fair really although I acknowledge that the cost of holding "every part" (slow, medium, erratic and fast movers) is enormous.

Regards
John ZU-CIB

This is a free market and it is your choice entirely to buy from them or not.

How does that fit in with the new proposed maintainance changes for the near future?? Surely the R52.23 o-ring will be considered as "airworthy" while the R7.00 o-ring will be not align itself with the "manufacturers requirements".......... will we have the freedom to use the free market

The Midas radiator cap more than likely will NOT fit your Rotax. It will be too short. Midas does not stock the right item, so back to the agents, or cook your engine for the price of a radiator cap. Like one of the guys mentioned. It is a free market out there. The choise is yours. :D

I think you have to decide what it is that you need replaced the o-ring sure as long as it isnt a fong kong one but when it comes to rings etc. Ill stick to the manufacturer.

Boet is right about the radiator cap. I have the lower PSI rating pressure cap and wanted to replace it with the higher rating. I went to Midas and they supplied me a cap for 50 bucks. It doesn't fit. The inner portion (the spring and rubber part) is too big for the minute hole in the expansion chamber.

Like I said, compare their prices to any of the internationals and you will see they are comparable. Let's not bash Aviation Engines here, but rather bash Rotax for pulling the ring out. The service and support you get from Niren and the guys is impeccable.

Nobody is forcing you to buy from them

By the way, the Bing 54 carburetor is used on a lot of BMW motor bikes and on Bombadier (the same company as Rotax) Jet skis and quads. If you need spares try them as well.

Iceman wrote:How does that fit in with the new proposed maintainance changes for the near future

Good question, but then the rotax manual states clearly that the engine is not a certified engine, can stop at any time blah blah blah, so they cannot enforce the same rules as for certified engines

Besides NGK is NGK, whether you buy it from AE or not.

The only time you are stuck is for main block and gearbox spares.

Ultralight news gives the price of $1218.50 canadian for a 503 crank, that equates to US$1233 * 10 = R12330. This is the price you will land it at in SA if you bring it in yourself. I understand that AE sell this unit for about R7000, saving you money.

So no bashing of Aviation Engines please

Morph wrote:Ultralight news gives the price of $1218.50 canadian for a 503 crank, that equates to US$1233 * 10 = R12330. This is the price you will land it at in SA if you bring it in yourself. I understand that AE sell this unit for about R7000, saving you money.

That looks like the cost of a single ignition crank. We purchased one from the SA agents a few years back at a price like that.

Agreed - in some cases - penny wise - pound foolish. Then again - was once told by an avid homebuilder that the sign of a good homebuilder is the ability to 'scratch' around.

Parts received from Rotax are not individually packed, eg. o-rings are received all packed into a single bag. We then repack each item individually.

I would like to assure everyone out there that it is not in our best interests to sell locally sourced parts as genuine. It is imperative for our business that we (and you) have the support from Rotax for each part sold.

I will not deny the fact that Rotax parts are expensive and so are genuine parts for your car.

One must also consider the complexity involved in getting suppliers of parts to allow their products to be used in aviation due to the liability implications. Many of you may say that we and Rotax are hiding behind liability excuses, but it is a real problem for businesses and perhaps not to you, the end-user.

We also have a comprehensive batch and serial tracking of all parts. Each o-ring sold can be traced back to a Rotax batch and in the event of a recall, we are able to contact everyone who purchased a part in an affected batch. The batching system also controls the shelf life of parts, in particular rubber components have a shelf life of five years at which time they are thrown away.

Although many of the parts, eg. o-rings & bearings are available off the shelf at most other outlets, Rotax genuine parts undergo an extensive quality checking process to ensure the reliability of parts for your aircraft.

The choice is yours, genuine or non-genuine, but you must remember that we will supply you with the correct part and required quality, first time. If R50 is an issue for you, you are free to puchase it elsewhere. You will also need to check that the o-ring is compatible for the application, are you sure that it won't be attacked by the oil? If it leaks, was it worth the hassle?

Thank you to all those who responded in support of us.

Niren
Thanks for responding.

In response to Niren's and others comment about not having to use Aviation Engines.

A personal friend of mine was employed by K&N air filters. When I enquired about purchasing air filters for my Rotax from them, I was informed that they will gladly supply but I must bear in mind that it will be cheaper to purchase from Aviation Engines. On further enquiry, I was told that there was an "agreement" in place with Aviation Engines and thus a higher price to encourage people to purchase from the "people that give you the best possible deal, given the extensive testing".

To me, I seem to see fewer options as to whom I may purchase from.

I eventually imported both filters from a vehicle parts supplier in the UK for less than the cost af a single filter from Aviation Engines and believe me, there is no telling the "genuine" part from the "pirate" vehicle part.

Before one makes rash statements about genuine parts for ones car. I recently rebuilt my 40 year old sports car, which included replacing every moving part in the engine, gearbox and differential. I then rebuilt the front and rear suspension and resprayed the thing just for good measure. My total bill - Less than R25 000.00.

Nobody minds if you run a profitable business in a free market economy, but there is a difference between making a profit and just pulling the ring out of the whole deal.

Lessons have obviously been learned from the likes of Telkom and Eskom as far as fair compeition and trading is concerned.

Hi Everybody,

I agree that Rotax spares is very expensive. I also don't understand the point made about possible claims, because as far as I know the two stroke engines are not aircraft approved, so you fly at your own risk.

Noboddy can justify R50+ for an O-ring, especially when Rotax states that they manufacture 100 000 plus engines per year.I know Demon and others might be satified and I don't fault their service, but they are now doing what all banks are doing-----Sorry sir there's nothing we can do the decision comes from head office.

I'm just curious whether Aiviation Engines has relayed the message from their unsatisfied customers to the supplier.

I have sent them an e-mail but received no reply. Maybe one day they might get some competition.

Fly safe
cutman

Aviation Engines wrote:Parts received from Rotax are not individually packed, eg. o-rings are received all packed into a single bag. We then repack each item individually.

Hi Niren,

Thanks for responding. I echo the other sentiments about great service and back-up from you guys.

Regards
John ZU-CIB