TOPLESS? A sceptic takes the plunge! Will keep you posted!

[Asterix]

Trustworthy fellow-aviators, I am in a fix. To the point of depression, at this stage! I AM ASKING FOR INFORMED HELP!!

Briefly - as you might know - I am having trouble with hangarage @ Polokwane. Too many rules / politics to my personal liking to spend R 120,000 on a hangar. Nice Yellow Cobra, standing @ Potties, but just too far to fly regularly. (And also - clear skies @ Poloks - and once you get to the southern side of the Ysterberg - LOW CLOUD - and you turn around. 75 k's to Potties, 16 k's to Polokwane.

From a purely financial point of view it would make more sense to take the Cobra to Jenya again, and pay him to chop of the kingpost and remove the reflex bridle. And do whatever else he needs to do to get it topless.

The Cobra should then fit into a standard hangar - and no money would have to be spend on building / converting hangars. (Also future hangar - related kak is sorted, should I be transfered AGAIN.) (Which happens every 3 years or so when you work for a bank.. )

So - funds aside - I am faced with this tremendous pshycological thing about losing my kingpost, landing wires and lufflines. Will I be facing potential tumbles and tucks and extreme dives once I loose my reflex? Should I overcome deepseated personal fears and have my trike topless but at least nearby? Or will I pay a potential deadly price? (I am really shit scared about the idea of going into an involuntary dive in turbulence, and the trike does not recover...)

Informed opinions - "If you were me - would you convert your Cobra to topless - to make it fit into a hangar and be near you?"

Please Help?

[Triker]

Hi Asterix

My short answer would be to leave your wing as is. I am sure there are other alternatives with regards to hangaring??

If you decide to go to Jenya, as you know, make double sure about the final BOTTOM LINE PRICE that he will be charging beforehand.

The less you chop and change on your existing (proven) wing, the better

My 2c's
All the best

Of blaas jou wiele af man, dan fit jy dalk in die hangar

[Loco]

Hi Asterix, I have a friend that flies a topless wing and he absolutely loves it, hes flown in some crazy conditions and it handled it perfectly, if you want I can PM you hes contact details so you guys can have a good chat

He will also be flying to the Tedderfield meet if you'd like to get 1'st hand experience as pax (I'm sure he'll take you for a spin)

But I guess you like and trust what youre used to

How much will it cost to convert your wing? Last time I checked with Jenya he quoted me R12,000 to convert mine since it had most things done already, Im also thinking of doing it purely for the fact of not having to take he wing off when trailering (i hate it and its a moerse job no matter what anybody tells me hehe )

Cheers
Ant

[Asterix]

Triker - you can't just tell me that you would leave it as is without qualifying that.

Anthony - yes - I have heard from a couple of guys that it is wonderful. However, without trying to be nasty, some of these pilots judge their experience from smooth conditions around the patch, and I know a pilot who aborted a x country halfway because the inputs to keep the topless trike from diving all the time became too much for his arms and mind, and he landed on an airstrip and trailered back a week later. This while a standard Aquila 1 wing 503 Windlass next to him carried on through midday for another 80 miles, very uncomfortable, but without feeling that control is being lost.

This is my problem - I am sure I can fly circuits to my hearts content during smooth mornings - topless or not. However - I fly mainly for the X country part of it, and I want to know what happens when I start to fight serious turbulence somewhere between "nothing and nerens?" With GeelKerneels, and the Cobra as it stands, I have been able to battle through it - on a couple of occasions just waiting for the reflex bridle to recover me from a dive with minimum input, and maximum butt-clenching.

How will this change if I go topless? Will my trike still be there for me when I decide "to let it recover", while I just hang on? Or will I start looking at that little red lever as she dives and dives..and dives..

[Boet]

Tyd dat jy vir jou n errie aanskaf wat in meer hangars inpas. En jou nie moertoe laat worrie as jy n paar stampies in die lug raakry nie!!

[Asterix]

Jaaa Boet! Gelukkig het ek nog nooit die nodigheid gesien om 'n trike op 'n trailer te laai nie - hulle het vlerke - hulle vlieg waar hulle wil wees!

Ek hoor jou ... eventually is dit seker maar op my horison, Maar vir nou wil ek nog bietjie trike vlieg! Die stampe pla my eintlik glad nie - vra maar my tjommies! (Die TOPLESS ding pla my egter so bietjie...ek weet nie hoe "tried and tested" dit regtig is nie...)

[Bundy]

Ja jou Geel gevlerkte wetter....

James, as you well know, I cannot comment on the flight characteristics of a topless wing....never piloted one myself. I think there are very few topless cobra wings around for this debate too? (But I may be wrong so dont shoot me ) Jenya is probably the only person who can give you this information...how's your Ukranian?

I do however subcribe to the age old philosophy of "if it aint broke...dont fix it". Making major alterations to a wing simply so it can fit in a blik hanger seems a little extreme to me? You must proceed with caution chom.

I do know how frustrating it can be to travel so far just to have to turn around and go home due to bad weather. My Training school was 60 clicks one way and believe me this Isuzu of mine burnt plenty 93 UL for sweet f@kkol on many occasions.
Considering the fact that you may not be up north on a permanent basis (IE you may get re deployed in a year or 3), and also taking into account you stay in a "lock up and go" enviroment with no nagging wife, dog, skoonma or anything else to screw up your weekend....why not org with Nicow to be able to stay at Potties lets say every 2nd weekend? That way you can duck out on a Fri evening and comeback Sunday...almost garuanteeing a "sortie" somewhere down the line? (Remember your caravan idea?) It's a mission, but prob the best and cost effective option without the anxiety of major structural changes to a wing that you allready had a few "issues" with? (There are also far less politics at Potties Im sure!)

It also leaves you with that R120k towards your possible 3 axis ambitions too.

Plan B: Put in for a transfer back to PTA!!!! Ons miss jou hier by FABA

Ek voel vir jou maat...hope you find a workable solution soon.

[Tumbleweed]

What happened to installing a swing gate above the door to accomodate the the king post?

[Africa]

I was at FAPI this week. Met some of the guys and everyone seems so nice? have you talked to everyone with the tall hangars?

[D2O]

Had a chat to Alex before buying a trike with a topless wing, and he cautioned me that topless wings can be difficult to control in less than perfect weather, and is prone to wing tip stall.

I know 75 odd km is far to drive to go fly, but I've been doing a 90 km trek from Randburg to Rhino Park to go fly for 4 years now. Yes, it's a schlep, but I still get to go fly. The money you'll spend on a wing mod that you might not like anyway will be way more than the fuel cost if you travel the 75km to the airfield.

[Asterix]

Had crucial and in depth discussions with people I totally trust today.

"Alea Jacta Est."

The Cobra is going to Petit next Friday, via trailer. There to lose its kingpost and wires. It Might be: 1) A big mistake, 2) A big eye-opener.

I'll be your "Ask him" guy in a year or so when people want to know about topless Cobras. Spoke to Jenya - price is very reasonable, in the light of the fact that he redid the wing last year.

Tumbleweed - too much engineering involved specifically where I can hangar. (LDV) Also - this sorts the problem long term.

Topic closed. As said above - "Alea Jacta Est." I am crossing the Rubicon. I might be delighted, or very disappointed. Time will tell.

[Asterix]

I was at FAPI this week. Met some of the guys and everyone seems so nice? have you talked to everyone with the tall hangars?

They ARE nice people. Problem with those nice and tall hangars is that they house commercial operations, and / or house BIG aeries (King Airs , Caravans etc.) And who wants a trike in the way every day of the week at your place of business as you work? Totally understandable.

So topless it is. (I'll be the guy who explains on this forum if it is worth it or not in 9 - 12 months. After a X country or two. )

D2O - I respect the views of Leprechaun very deeply - he was one of my instructors - but at this stage - I am taking the plunge. If it is a mistake - at least then I will close the whole debate for GOOD - because believe you me - I will be quite outspoken about it.

[Sukkelaar]

Praat met Hendrik Loots op die forum, hy het al twee of drie trikes ge-topless, en het al SA verteenwoordig, so hy WEET waarvan hy praat.

Ek persoonlik het al met n topless in die somer n paar keer vannaf die Rand na Augrabies toe en terug gevlieg en in erge turbulensie sonder enige moeite, oggende vertrek en middae laat daar aangekom ( en omgekeerd terug) in 35 grade plus temperatuur gedurende die dag. Het al n paar keer ook vannaf Oos Rand na Empangeni, Oos Rand Na Margate, Oos Rand na Numbi gevlieg en volgens my is daar nie n groot verskil tussen n gewone vlerk en n topless nie die topless het bietjie minder wind weerstand en die stuur daarvan is bietjie meer direk. Voordele is dat dit baie maklik opslaan, in enige hanger kan slaap, jou n paar liter petrol spaar, en effens vinnger is.

Groete

[Blue Max]

daar nie n groot verskil tussen n gewone vlerk en n topless nie die topless het bietjie minder wind weerstand en die stuur daarvan is bietjie meer direk. Voordele is dat dit baie maklik opslaan, in enige hanger kan slaap, jou n paar liter petrol spaar, en effens vinnger is

( dit is n GROOT verskil)!!!!
Daar het jy dit chom en n topless is mos vanselfsprekend meer aantreklik.
En ek vermoed, as daar nog trike vervaardigers is sal hulle almal topless begin gaan want lets face it daardie kingpost met die luffwires is n lot onaantreklike klomp drag...
Vir ons hier ter gronde hou dit die voordeel in dat jy die saak nou vir ons ordentlik gaan toets, gereeld verslag lewer, en uiteindelik dalk vir ons gaan oortuig om jou pad te volg....!!!
Check jou!!!

[Boet]

Jaaaaa, maar ek vou net sy vlerke terug om hom so een keer per jaar dorp toe te vat, sodat ek ORDENTLIKE aandag aan die vliegtuigie kan gee. Dis n baie handige feature, en dis hoekom ek n Explorer vlieg! LW, vlieg met die deur oop. Dit was effens warm vanoggend.