TO SAVE OR NOT TO SAVE THE RHINO!!!!

[flying4rhino]

SWAT IS ONLY TRYING TO HELP SAVE RHINOS

http://www.avcom.co.za/phpBB3/viewtopic ... 1&t=103794


http://www.facebook.com/SwatPatrolUk?ref=hl

[Boet]

What about saving the white oh ??

[flying4rhino]

My Name is Frank not Jesus

[Boet]

[Tumbleweed]

Good luck with your endevours.

Thought I would acklowledge your post in case you thought no none gives a sh!t.

As you seemed to have realised, there is no unified stratergy to tackle this. Some game parks encourage participation, others resent it, some might even profit in it. Professional hunters make money, rhino 'farmers' are waiting for their ticket and the goverment does'nt have the political will to commit to it.

If half the money raised would go towards appointing hit squads to wipe out the Chinese/ Vietnam/ Arabic end buyers and fund special forces training to hunt and shoot on -site any would- be pouchers, I reckon you would halve the killings instantly.

Then the international comunity could re-look the Cites convention and allow the controlled selling of rhino horn and ivory to offset proper conservation which does not include zoos charging entrance fees to finance supposed breeding / education programmes. Apes, elephant and wild cats do not belong in Europe and America and those supporters should rather travel to Africa and spend their money here.

While we're at it, lets wipe out the private owners of big cats in the States and the Japs harpooning the whales.

What about the perlemoen/ Abelone pshycos? The stuff tastes crap anyway.

Then we can start with the bush meat gorrilla hand ashtray business and selling of exotic birds and reptiles.

I think we're our own worst enemy.

[WOBBLY]

Tumbleweed,

As a person in support of the SWAT Project I feel I should respond to your acknowledgement.
We fully understand that there will never be a united stance on what SWAT and other Aerial Support Units want to achieve and understandably there will always be a divide in how it is perceived.

Lets be honest here, Professional Rhino Hunters make a lot of money from the sales of Rhino Horn and there is a possibility 'insider trading' goes on within Gamekeepers and the Poachers. Now I live in the real world and accept that people will go to great lengths to support their families, what I can't understand is why these poachers kill an entire Rhino just for the Horn ? Regularly Gamekeepers / Vets remove the Horn by Dehorning and it is done under tranquillizer serum, I am not condoning poaching but if it has to go on surely if dehorning was all the poachers actually did under a tranquillizer shot the Rhino population wouldn't diminish at the rate it currently is ?

You mention that you would like to see 50% of the money put into appointing hit squads to wipe out the Chinese/ Vietnam/ Arabic end buyers and fund special forces training to hunt and shoot on-site any would be poachers, so effectively you are saying that the solution is to be as barbaric towards poachers as they are to your ANIMALS ?

Part of the problem is that CITES has 'stockpiled' Rhino Horn & Elephant Tusks and due to the limited amount available now the price per KG is astronomical, CITES can actually reverse the poaching issue by unlocking the stockpile and supplying the demand.

I do not agree that your philosophy about Rhino, Hippo,Apes, Elephant and Wild Cats not belonging in European and American zoos and that those supporters should rather travel to Africa and spend their money there holds any credibility. All Wildlife placed within European and American Zoo's are given the best care there is and whilst they are kept in captivity they actually have a better life expectancy than in the wilds of Africa etc.

SWAT has Voluntary personnel who are prepared to come to Africa to assist you with your Rhino dilemma and indeed any wildlife poaching issues, what will SWAT get out of it ? Well we could quite easily end up with a Volunteer having a tag on their toe or we could equally end up with a sense of achievement from having helped Africa with a Wildlife conservation issue.

Perlemoen & Abelone psychos are only snails and if they are ate as a delicacy like the French do, then cie la vie.

Private Owners of Big Cats are just 'self indulgent weiners' but again their personal care of the Big Cats is still offering them a better life expectancy than in the wilds of Africa and in most cases an expanse to roam in etc.

We can't please everyone and that is why it will be a debate that will ever be fully answered

[Wildtreks]

I would worry more about the shark fishing in SA waters, sharks we can´t live without..

[flying4rhino]

Thankyou Tumbleweed , "vested interests is preventing swat saving rhinos"
Onwards and upwards.

Good luck with your endevours.

Thought I would acklowledge your post in case you thought no none gives a sh!t.

As you seemed to have realised, there is no unified stratergy to tackle this. Some game parks encourage participation, others resent it, some might even profit in it. Professional hunters make money, rhino 'farmers' are waiting for their ticket and the goverment does'nt have the political will to commit to it.

If half the money raised would go towards appointing hit squads to wipe out the Chinese/ Vietnam/ Arabic end buyers and fund special forces training to hunt and shoot on -site any would- be pouchers, I reckon you would halve the killings instantly.

Then the international comunity could re-look the Cites convention and allow the controlled selling of rhino horn and ivory to offset proper conservation which does not include zoos charging entrance fees to finance supposed breeding / education programmes. Apes, elephant and wild cats do not belong in Europe and America and those supporters should rather travel to Africa and spend their money here.

While we're at it, lets wipe out the private owners of big cats in the States and the Japs harpooning the whales.

What about the perlemoen/ Abelone pshycos? The stuff tastes crap anyway.

Then we can start with the bush meat gorrilla hand ashtray business and selling of exotic birds and reptiles.

I think we're our own worst enemy.

[flying4rhino]

Oh i forgot to mention, what will happen when all the rhinos disappear and the tourist stop coming, because of their ignorance !

The consequences to save the rhinos are greater than not to save them as this will effect your economy resulting job losses.

[flying4rhino]

With sympathy to 650 rhinos lost 2012. Your in our thoughts SWAT will not give in the fight to protect you despite of invested interests...

[Tumbleweed]

You've incorrectly implied that I made this quote.

Thankyou Tumbleweed , "vested interests is preventing swat saving rhinos"
Onwards and upwards.

I can't think anyone will be against you establishing your operation here besides those involved in pouching, in fact I'm sure you have all the support of the public and the game industry.

Your challenge is to convince the role players that your intentions and operation will not clash with whatever plans are already in place, which obviously differ from game park to private game farm.

Take the advise from those who have already vollenteered and share with us your progress and interaction with the Bateleurs and other organisations.

You might find a bunch of microlighters vollenteering for the odd weekend patrol.

Good luck.

[flying4rhino]

Re: Dear SWAT PILOTS

by WOBBLY » Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:31 pm

SWAT AERIAL SUPPORT is currently in the midst of a bag of 'mixed emotions' which is sometimes very rewarding and sometimes very disconcerting, I think it is fair to say that we as a Volunteer Group are meeting with some hurdles and some 'open gates'
Thankfully the 'Open Gates' are more rewarding than the Hurdles are disconcerting.
We now have a SWAT base in the Gauteng Region with fantastic facilities so we can serve Game Parks & National Parks nearby. We are also ready to set up in Zimbabwe once the Microlights are confirmed there.

As the Zimbabwe Aerial Support Unit is a pre-existing Unit that was made Dormant by Mismanagement by the previous Aircrew I am being 'seconded' to them as a 'Stand Alone' Unit of SWAT and will fly for them until such times as I feel that the Unit will not be mismanaged by my successors.
For the Zimbabwe Unit I am ideally looking for my successor to be with me from the outset so I can be 100% certain that it will continue to operate the way I set it up. The Zim Support will cover the "Big 5" as opposed to just Rhino and today a pledge of €750,000 (350,000,000.00 ZWD ) was made for a 5yr plan. ( €150,000 p.a. ) by a Large Corporation in the EU.

Now all this sounds all great & dandy but without Game Parks in SA we are struggling to get financial support for our SA Operations.

[Dobbs]

Wobbly, this morning I have sent an email to both Peter and Frank, presumably you know who they are - expressing interest in what your organization has to offer. I have previously mentioned that, for obvious reasons, there is a lot of trepidation about opening the flood gates to all who express an interest in assisting.

What is required is a low key, concerted, sustainable effort which supports the structures already in place.

What is not required is people looking for publicity, utilizing this effort to get cheap air hours etc

ps - I am not implying that this is the case with you / your organization, I am just saying that any / all potential interventions will be very well scrutinized as to their real intent - if legitimate, they will be welcomed aboard.

[nicow]

Save the farmer,and they'll look after their rhinos-the nature reserves can employ people to save their own rhinos....

[WOBBLY]

Save the farmer,and they'll look after their rhinos-the nature reserves can employ people to save their own rhinos....

Really ? Zimbabwe could face a future without any more rhino, if urgent measures to tackle poaching are not implemented.

This was the warning of a leading conservationist on Friday, who was reacting to news that four white rhino had been killed by suspected poachers on New Years Day this week.

Johnny Rodrigues, the chairman of the Zimbabwe Conservation Task Force, told SW Radio Africa on Friday that the poaching situation is "disgusting," and one that is likely to get worse.

"Our (poaching) figures aren't at the stage where anyone is actively trying to protect the animals. And the syndicates are in high gear," Rodrigues warned.

The four white rhinos that were killed this week were found at Thetford Estate in Mazowe on News Years Day. Zimbabwe Parks and Wildlife Management Authority Public Relations Manager, Caroline Washaya-Moyo, said the animals included two adult males, one adult female and one sub-adult male, valued at US$480,000.

Washaya-Moyo added that a total of eight rhino horns were recovered at the scene and 18 spent cartridges, which had been fired from a suspected 308 hunting rifle or an FN automatic rifle.

In 2012 the country lost 19 black and white rhinos to poachers. Neighbouring South Africa lost an unprecedented 633 rhino in the same year. Rodrigues said that while Zimbabwe's rhino poaching statistics are not yet as bad as South Africa's, it is still a serious problem.

"South Africa's poaching statistics are high but if you look at it, we don't even have that many rhino left in Zimbabwe. If we don't put the measures in place now, the animals will be extinct in the next couple years," Rodrigues said.

Meanwhile there is mounting speculation that there is more than meets the eye in the suspected 'poaching' of the rhino on Thetford Estate, which belongs to controversial businessman and known ZANU PF crony John Bredenkamp.

Thetford Estate, a 1 300-hectare holding in the Mazowe Valley, is a registered conservancy, breeding a variety of wildlife species. Bredenkamp bought the estate from the Gulliver family in 1999 after obtaining a certificate of 'no interest' from the then ZANU PF government. In September 2000 the farm received a Section 5 order for acquisition, which was then withdrawn in October that year.

In March 2002 the farm was listed again and war vets reportedly disrupted operations, in what was widely believed to be a deliberate attempt to 'punish' Bredenkamp for 'funding' Emmerson Mnangagwa's succession campaign.

So lets not assume that your statement rings true