Microlighters SENSORSHIP.
Re: Microlighters SENSORSHIP.
Let me clarify...... MYR is not English speaking, his home language is French. His use of english is rather good for a French speaking bloke, but he sometimes find it very difficult to say what he really wants to, and so come out somewhat "blunt". And somewhat a bit too much to the point. Al he wants is a bit of help from fellow flyers, in another country. If we will not help him, his dream of owning his own aeroplane will be lost forever. Sad. So whoever gives him a bit of gas, please gentlemen. let`s be just that: GENTLEMEN. After all, we are all just guys who love flying,even though we do not speak the same language. It is clear to me that the engine manufacturor in question is not very keen to offer his assistance, so everything that will happen to him and his company forthwith, he brought unto him all by himself. I will not buy his engine. Period.
Re: Microlighters SENSORSHIP.
Boet wrote:Let me clarify...... MYR is not English speaking, his home language is French. His use of english is rather good for a French speaking bloke, but he sometimes find it very difficult to say what he really wants to, and so come out somewhat "blunt". And somewhat a bit too much to the point. Al he wants is a bit of help from fellow flyers, in another country. If we will not help him, his dream of owning his own aeroplane will be lost forever. Sad. So whoever gives him a bit of gas, please gentlemen. let`s be just that: GENTLEMEN. After all, we are all just guys who love flying,even though we do not speak the same language. It is clear to me that the engine manufacturor in question is not very keen to offer his assistance, so everything that will happen to him and his company forthwith, he brought unto him all by himself. I will not buy his engine. Period.
Flying feeds the soul!
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Air Hog
- The Boss
- Posts: 1783
- Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 5:53 pm
- Location: Kroon Airfield, Home of Rosslyn Microflyers, Pretoria
Re: Microlighters SENSORSHIP.
Although this specific thread makes me think I'am on the wrong Forum, I think this can now stop.
This whole thing was blown right out off context. All the guy wanted was some support which because of this, he did not get.
Place yourself in his shoes, you would most probably have approach it differently, but I am sure you would have tried all you could to have summoned support somehow.
Give the man a break.
This whole thing was blown right out off context. All the guy wanted was some support which because of this, he did not get.
Place yourself in his shoes, you would most probably have approach it differently, but I am sure you would have tried all you could to have summoned support somehow.
Give the man a break.
Johan Welman - aka Air Hog
"The sky is not the limit... it is where the fun starts!!"
"The sky is not the limit... it is where the fun starts!!"
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MYR
- Solo cross country
- Posts: 127
- Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2008 8:41 pm
- Location: Reunion Island
- Contact:
My explanations
.
Hours time difference:
11:30 I just discovered the existence of this subject. Start writing and translation.
17:53 I just finished the letter. I have not eaten since yesterday. For several days I have only slept a few hours. I'm busy for months to make investigations about the failure of my engine, about business practices of UL POWER company, Find out about way of working of this company, Send spies in Belgium as to see how the engines are tested and with which electronic components, Look for owners and victims all over the world, Ask them questions.
I have to work and deal with my personal problems simultaneously. My clients want to kill me because the work is not done. The days are not long enough. The smallest letter of a few lines takes me hours. Try to write a letter in a language you do not know (even with Google), you'll understand quickly.
Before, I have to recall the facts because without it, readers can not understand.
I have odered a Bushbaby Explorer. I have make sent a UL POWER AERO ENGINE 260i from Belgium to South-Africa. SA PLANES (or KIT PLANES FOR AFRICA) was charged with making the installation.
I am a french speaking person. I have been living in Reunion Island. The last time I spoke english was when I was in school 30 years ago.
I have written many letters to the boss of this company. The only answer I get is a bill. No negotiation is possible. At the current stage, he will bend only under the threat.
What are my options? Beat him? Arriving at his office with a gun? I am not violent, I am skinny, and I am 10 000 km away from him.
Make a trial? The language of the court is Dutch. Any translation will cost me a fortune. The first decision of Justice will be made within 5 years, the second one 10 years later. During this time my plane will not fly. Even when there will be a good court decision, the boss of UL POWER will not pay. I'll have to make an other trial to be paid. Someone who knows him (an other victim of this guy) has said it to me: It's not his style to pay. Anyway, I do not have the first penny to pay for a lawyer, even for ask him to write a simple letter.
I then devised a scheme:
Seek the assistance of members of this forum. As you know, I have writen a request for assistance to the persons attending the Bushbaby forum. The idea was to react the people to say what they think of this scam. Initially the plan worked perfectly. It was easy to understand that I was a victim and that the other side there is a rogue. Several people have understood my distress and expressed themselves on the Bushbaby forum. I thank them very much. From that moment, I could take my phone and have an explanation with the boss of UL POWER. I could have said: "The construction of my plane is shown in a South African forum. People do not understand your behavior. They are so disgusted by your practices that they decided never to buy your motor. If you continue, I denounce your practices in all countries where there is a forum on aviation". I am sure he would have sent the parts the same day.
Anyway,I would not have lied. Before I even put my plan into action, the boss of SA PLANES had already decided to never install one more engine of this brand and to discourage everybody to do it. It is still writen. So, there was no more future for this engine in South-Africa.
I was not asking anyone to lie, I have asked them to make virulent statements so that the boss of UL POWER understand what could happen elsewhere. No one was compelled to do so. Only volunteers were solicited. I was imagining that those who doesn't agree with my method would keep quiet. it was a huge mistake.
Right now, some people believe that my goal is that this company no longer sells. My answer is "I do not care. They could sell 0 or 1 000 000 engines, that's the same thing for me." My first goal is to get for free the parts that the belgian company owes me. For this, I have only one way: the help of South Africans, after the threat. The plan worked perfectly until someone made a scandal. It broke my strategy. If the boss UL POWER came here, he'll die laughing. He would see that my plan has failed because of a minority of persons that have nothing to do the misfortunes of others.
Some people have no idea of the consequences of their actions. Some other that have the power to do something have no idea of the consequences of their lack of action. The result is that they protect a dishonest person against a honest person. I wonder whether they are aware or if their morality is different than mine. Worse, I am taken to a scoundrel. I am extremely surprised by this mentality. Because of the delinquency and extreme violence that exists in SA, I thought that there is solidarity with one another. This is not the case. I guess the persons who attack me have seen that I have been living in Reunion Island. They certainly imagine that I do not belong to the same ethnic group, the same religion as them. This is certainly the reason for their hatred towards me. I can propose these persons to send to them my photo and my certificate of baptism. If that's not enough I can send a genetic analysis if they pay the lab fees.
The behavior of some people makes me say what I did not want to say :
I have ordered my plane for almost 3 years. I have not flown during this time and I will perhaps never fly. Now the plane is built, it is grounded for 5 months because of the engine trouble and the scam I am victim. May I recall that UL POWER is the sole responsible for this failure? For the moment, the dream of a lifetime is on the ground.
For some time, my financial situation has changed. A world crisis have emerged and personal problems as well. I'm running out of money. In addition, a psychological barrier prevents me be sodomized by UL POWER. I do not want to pay these parts twice.
One of the leaders of this forum has told me things like this in several private messages :
I suppose there are big problems caused by inaccurate translations. Unfortunately this person did not understand the situation. I can not be more clear. I can just say : Officials of this forum can solve the problem in 3 clicks and 15 seconds.
The decision to take is very simple :
Analyze the situation in terms of morality, then choose one of these two possibilities:
1/ Do nothing. In a few days, I'll ask SA PLANE to remove the engine and send it I don't know where. The rest of the aircraft will be on sale.
2/ Remove the messages that harmed me, and leave those of the people who have helped me.
Hours time difference:
11:30 I just discovered the existence of this subject. Start writing and translation.
17:53 I just finished the letter. I have not eaten since yesterday. For several days I have only slept a few hours. I'm busy for months to make investigations about the failure of my engine, about business practices of UL POWER company, Find out about way of working of this company, Send spies in Belgium as to see how the engines are tested and with which electronic components, Look for owners and victims all over the world, Ask them questions.
I have to work and deal with my personal problems simultaneously. My clients want to kill me because the work is not done. The days are not long enough. The smallest letter of a few lines takes me hours. Try to write a letter in a language you do not know (even with Google), you'll understand quickly.
Before, I have to recall the facts because without it, readers can not understand.
I have odered a Bushbaby Explorer. I have make sent a UL POWER AERO ENGINE 260i from Belgium to South-Africa. SA PLANES (or KIT PLANES FOR AFRICA) was charged with making the installation.
I am a french speaking person. I have been living in Reunion Island. The last time I spoke english was when I was in school 30 years ago.
- The belgian engine manufacturer UL POWER has sent to SA PLANES an engine that could not function. The two electrical harness were not compatible with the two ECUS (redundant system). It took me months as to understand this.
- Then, UL POWER company has requested the return of the parts in question.
- They have demanded the South African installer to send the parcel with UPS, and assess the value of the goods to €5. There is written evidence.
- The belgian boss who was paying transportation with the own UPS account of his company has chosen to not insure the package (€ 4,000 value - About R 43,000).
- The package was lost by UPS. UL POWER company has received a refund of €80 (let's say R800).
- UL POWER company wants me or the SA installer of my engine to pay for new parts when they are doubly responsible: They are responsible for a technical problem and for a bad decision about transportation insurance.
I have written many letters to the boss of this company. The only answer I get is a bill. No negotiation is possible. At the current stage, he will bend only under the threat.
What are my options? Beat him? Arriving at his office with a gun? I am not violent, I am skinny, and I am 10 000 km away from him.
Make a trial? The language of the court is Dutch. Any translation will cost me a fortune. The first decision of Justice will be made within 5 years, the second one 10 years later. During this time my plane will not fly. Even when there will be a good court decision, the boss of UL POWER will not pay. I'll have to make an other trial to be paid. Someone who knows him (an other victim of this guy) has said it to me: It's not his style to pay. Anyway, I do not have the first penny to pay for a lawyer, even for ask him to write a simple letter.
I then devised a scheme:
Seek the assistance of members of this forum. As you know, I have writen a request for assistance to the persons attending the Bushbaby forum. The idea was to react the people to say what they think of this scam. Initially the plan worked perfectly. It was easy to understand that I was a victim and that the other side there is a rogue. Several people have understood my distress and expressed themselves on the Bushbaby forum. I thank them very much. From that moment, I could take my phone and have an explanation with the boss of UL POWER. I could have said: "The construction of my plane is shown in a South African forum. People do not understand your behavior. They are so disgusted by your practices that they decided never to buy your motor. If you continue, I denounce your practices in all countries where there is a forum on aviation". I am sure he would have sent the parts the same day.
Anyway,I would not have lied. Before I even put my plan into action, the boss of SA PLANES had already decided to never install one more engine of this brand and to discourage everybody to do it. It is still writen. So, there was no more future for this engine in South-Africa.
I was not asking anyone to lie, I have asked them to make virulent statements so that the boss of UL POWER understand what could happen elsewhere. No one was compelled to do so. Only volunteers were solicited. I was imagining that those who doesn't agree with my method would keep quiet. it was a huge mistake.
Right now, some people believe that my goal is that this company no longer sells. My answer is "I do not care. They could sell 0 or 1 000 000 engines, that's the same thing for me." My first goal is to get for free the parts that the belgian company owes me. For this, I have only one way: the help of South Africans, after the threat. The plan worked perfectly until someone made a scandal. It broke my strategy. If the boss UL POWER came here, he'll die laughing. He would see that my plan has failed because of a minority of persons that have nothing to do the misfortunes of others.
Some people have no idea of the consequences of their actions. Some other that have the power to do something have no idea of the consequences of their lack of action. The result is that they protect a dishonest person against a honest person. I wonder whether they are aware or if their morality is different than mine. Worse, I am taken to a scoundrel. I am extremely surprised by this mentality. Because of the delinquency and extreme violence that exists in SA, I thought that there is solidarity with one another. This is not the case. I guess the persons who attack me have seen that I have been living in Reunion Island. They certainly imagine that I do not belong to the same ethnic group, the same religion as them. This is certainly the reason for their hatred towards me. I can propose these persons to send to them my photo and my certificate of baptism. If that's not enough I can send a genetic analysis if they pay the lab fees.
The behavior of some people makes me say what I did not want to say :
I have ordered my plane for almost 3 years. I have not flown during this time and I will perhaps never fly. Now the plane is built, it is grounded for 5 months because of the engine trouble and the scam I am victim. May I recall that UL POWER is the sole responsible for this failure? For the moment, the dream of a lifetime is on the ground.
For some time, my financial situation has changed. A world crisis have emerged and personal problems as well. I'm running out of money. In addition, a psychological barrier prevents me be sodomized by UL POWER. I do not want to pay these parts twice.
One of the leaders of this forum has told me things like this in several private messages :
(...) I see how you have been ripped off but there is nothing I can do in my own capacity.
I am just a guy who flies for fun and (...)
I am sure my opinion or comments would have no influence on resolving your problems.
The only way is surely through dialog and negotiation with the engine manufacturer?
Good luck, I do understand how you feel
Regards (...)
I suppose there are big problems caused by inaccurate translations. Unfortunately this person did not understand the situation. I can not be more clear. I can just say : Officials of this forum can solve the problem in 3 clicks and 15 seconds.
The decision to take is very simple :
Analyze the situation in terms of morality, then choose one of these two possibilities:
1/ Do nothing. In a few days, I'll ask SA PLANE to remove the engine and send it I don't know where. The rest of the aircraft will be on sale.
2/ Remove the messages that harmed me, and leave those of the people who have helped me.
I'm a French speaking person. Sorry for the mistakes I can make.
If you don't understand what I say, do not hesitate to tell me.
Je fréquente aussi le forum : Le forum des ULM-ELA-LSA
If you don't understand what I say, do not hesitate to tell me.
Je fréquente aussi le forum : Le forum des ULM-ELA-LSA
Re: Microlighters SENSORSHIP.
Agreed.
Whilst there is a huge amount of sympathy for Myr the situation has turned into a mess and it's not what "our" forum is about.
Hindsight is always easy and I am sure that Laurent's objective would have been achieved without the PM backfire.
A suggestion:
Delete this thread and all the other stuff on the other one about the PMs.
Let the dust settle.
Let things develop as they should have.
Whilst there is a huge amount of sympathy for Myr the situation has turned into a mess and it's not what "our" forum is about.
Hindsight is always easy and I am sure that Laurent's objective would have been achieved without the PM backfire.
A suggestion:
Delete this thread and all the other stuff on the other one about the PMs.
Let the dust settle.
Let things develop as they should have.
Nottaquitta
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Gyronaut
- Toooooo Thousand
- Posts: 2265
- Joined: Mon Oct 30, 2006 4:26 pm
- Location: Morningstar - Cape Town, Western Cape
Re: Microlighters SENSORSHIP.
Hear Hear Mogas! 
There are always two sides to a story... Sorry to hear about your misfortune MYR.
My view on the matter is Censor This!
There are always two sides to a story... Sorry to hear about your misfortune MYR.
My view on the matter is Censor This!
- Attachments
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DarkHelmet
- Toooooo Thousand
- Posts: 2045
- Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 10:12 am
- Location: Jukskei Park - Randburg
Re: Microlighters SENSORSHIP.
no delete! just fires up more aggro, I am locking this. CLOSED. END OF CONVERSATION.
KFA Has explained to me why he deleted posts irrelevant to the build, he is a mod in the build forum, he felt they were not related to the topic.
KFA DO NOT DELETE POSTS AGAIN (written warning issued, Right here, in public, right now), you can move posts to seperate threads. see my post on moderation rules.
Gert, Rudix apologies for the deletion of your posts. thanks for bringing this to our attention Gert!
Topic now closed and locked! starting a new thread on forum moderation
See viewtopic.php?f=1&t=17307
Let's go fly!
KFA Has explained to me why he deleted posts irrelevant to the build, he is a mod in the build forum, he felt they were not related to the topic.
KFA DO NOT DELETE POSTS AGAIN (written warning issued, Right here, in public, right now), you can move posts to seperate threads. see my post on moderation rules.
Gert, Rudix apologies for the deletion of your posts. thanks for bringing this to our attention Gert!
Topic now closed and locked! starting a new thread on forum moderation
See viewtopic.php?f=1&t=17307
Let's go fly!
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